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Fluffal

Joined: Oct 20, 2017
Posts: 2
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Temp bans are more effective then permanent bans

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Thanks for taking the time to read this.

I have been back playing this game for a few months now after years of inactivity and I've noticed one very consistent problem come up again and again. Bans. Here on the forums and across the multiple discord channels I participate in. It's a serious issue and with a game that has a dwindling player base it's not an issue with much room to makes mistakes with.

I want to quote something that was posted by a GM on the World of Warcraft forms about Blizzards ideology behind their banning methods:

Through various studies (conducted both here at Blizzard and by other companies/groups), and by monitoring player behavior, we've discovered that suspensions are actually more effective than permabans for preventing repeat offenses by the same people.

There's some really interesting sociological hocus pocus behind it, but from what I understand, the TLDR is that if a botter gets permabanned, they'll often just buy a new account and go right back to botting. However, if we only suspend them -- meaning, they'll get their account back later -- they're less likely to buy a new one. Furthermore, once they do get their account back, they're EXTREMELY unlikely to bot again.

I'm not a psychology expert, but there's something about "I'll get this account back later" that leads more of these sorts of people to give up their botting ways than if their accounts had been permanently closed. It's kind of fascinating (at least I find it to be).

In just my very short time of being back on this game I have personally witnessed dozens of players permanently banned. This was really shocking to me, as compared to my 10 years playing World of Warcraft I'd only ever personally seen 1 player permanently banned.

It feels like the ban policy for Puzzle Pirates is a bit too heavy handed for the offenses being committed.

For example a mate on my crew was re-banned for "Ban Evading" because 7 years ago, as a child, they stole some PoE. Their appeal was denied. To me that seems like very extreme measure to take against an active player's 7 year old mistakes.

I believe if they had instead been given a temp ban, either back as a child, or now as an adult, they would have learned their lesson and returned a much more well behaved member of the player base. Instead, we now lose them completely because of a mistake they made years ago.

There are teachable mistakes. People can learn from what they've done, and learn not to do it again. But when someone is permanently banned they're never given that chance.

Obviously there will always be bad eggs that are too thick to learn, and those people will continue to re-offend, and be rightful permanently banned. But when a permanent ban is the first method of punishment you miss an opportunity to create a reformed player.

Players that have waited out a temp ban are more likely to appreciate the game and their place in it. As noted by the Blizzard employee above, it gives them something to look forward to, and a reason to never be in the same place they're in again. And personally I think that's a much better experience then losing that player completely. Especially when the game needs players to be successful. A redeemed player that made a mistake in the past, is better then no player at all.

Thanks again for taking the time to listen!

[Nov 4, 2017 7:04:17 PM]

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Devonin

Joined: Jul 28, 2003
Posts: 3576
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Re: Temp bans are more effective then permanent bans

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Out of curiosity, were you banned on a previous account? Asking for a friend.

[Nov 4, 2017 8:09:55 PM]

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Fluffal

Joined: Oct 20, 2017
Posts: 2
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Re: Temp bans are more effective then permanent bans

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Out of curiosity, were you banned on a previous account? Asking for a friend.

Haha no sir, this is just an observation I've made. I'm saying this as someone who cares about the longevity of a game that I enjoy, not as someone trying to defend cheating.
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[Edit 1 times, last edit by Fluffal at Nov 4, 2017 8:44:26 PM]

[Nov 4, 2017 8:38:36 PM]

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Filthyjake

Joined: Jun 14, 2012
Posts: 1115
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Re: Temp bans are more effective then permanent bans

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Couldn't agree more there are poorly defined TOS violations that are banable offences.

Stealing is defined as taking the in-game property of another player without the knowledge and permission of that player.

So the ship is left unlocked set for crew use and someone used the stock and didn't restock or moved it so they could use the ship and its stealing.... um the fact that it is set to crew use would imply permission to use.

Harassment can be defined as repeated actions that target an individual or group for the purpose of bringing about feelings of discomfort or distress.

Harassment is not allowed and may result in an account being banned from the game.

I called this one out in another post as a pvp ocean clearly can cause these feelings.
Ban Reasons

Ban Reasons
The following gives more information about ban reasons.
Account Theft: You were either directly responsible for or very closely related to someone who was responsible for stealing an account.
Ban Evasion: means that we found evidence that you were previously banned on another account. Sometimes that account will be specified in the ban reason.
Billing: There is a billing problem of some sort which we may need to resolve with you before you can access your account. Please contact our Billing Support through the support form if indicated by the ban message.
Botting: is the use of a third party program to play the game or perform some sort of automated task. The use of such programs is strictly prohibited. (Example: Using an automated program to bilge)
Cheating: This includes cheating or misrepresenting your skill at a wagered game, advertising a website with cheats or exploiting a bug for your own profit.
Compromised: This means that we believe someone has stolen your account and you should contact us through the support form to verify ownership of the account so we can return it to you. We are only able to verify ownership if there has been a purchase made on this account.
Hacking: is the modification of game files or the use of any sort of software or hardware to gain an advantage in the game.
Language: Using vulgar, obscene, or offensive language, including racial, sexual, or religious slurs. Misspelling or mis-spacing words to get around the filter will be treated as swearing.
Scamming: is when someone tries to trick another person into giving away their pieces of eight, doubloons, items or account information.
Speedhacking: is a specific type of hacking, this is the use of software or hardware aids to increase the speed of play on any puzzle to gain an advantage.
Theft is when something is taken from another pirate without their permission. Most thefts are the result of pieces of eight or items being taken from a ship, house, stall or shoppe.

I know someone who got banned for using macros on a keyboard for gunning under the botting rule.

Theft If the ship is unlocked you have been given permission to use the ship/stock hence why it called crew use. Lock or understand what your risking. Permission is given by the ship being left unlocked. Same as roommate/manager be selective don't store a million poe in your shop or understand what your risking its a pirate game yet doing the most pirate thing is against the rules (no I don't support theft its humor).

Cheating, so those able Sword fighters who are really alts of GM's are violating the rules. If an able sf is wagering large poe well buyer beware or cap the wagers to the rank of the players. Any one using alts could fall into this ban-able offence.
using alts to pvp would reduce the might ring allowing elite crews to attack weaker ships.

I don't like cheaters but longer suspensions (current max is 7 days )would be better then perma-bans
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Filthyjake all oceans (Obsidian Primary)
Filthyjake6145 (discord)
?Retired? On a Break? I found a new love...
Casual player or yet another who moved on.

[Nov 4, 2017 8:48:33 PM]

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Scarpath

Joined: Sep 7, 2014
Posts: 246
Status: Offline

Re: Temp bans are more effective then permanent bans

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I agree fully with this. We've seen a few players try to come back after one small rule broken, yet are not allowed because of the strict banning policy. There are many bad players that would just repeat the offence, yes, but I feel there are many, many more that would just come back as better players.

This would also help a lot with false botting tags. Yes, players would feel upset if they were suspended falsely, but they could still return to the game. It's hard to know why some seemingly innocent players have been hit with the ban hammer, and many cases of this 'false' ban could potentially be fixed by using suspensions before banning. If the players really were botting, then the system would just pick it right back up if they try to continue to do so.
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Scarpath on Emerald, Cerulean, and Meridian!

Also Scarpath on Obsidian, Defiant to the core.

Your grammar should at least be as good as mine, take the time to make it decent!

[Nov 7, 2017 6:16:18 PM]

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