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Belthazar451

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Hey CW - want me to do the 2006 images, since you can't log in at the moment?
[Feb 26, 2009 3:18:06 AM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
amoyer

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Give it a couple days. RL interfered more then anything else with the 2007 images. Guppymomma sent me all of the 2006 & 2007 images and looking at the 2006 images there are some filename issues to deal with as well. I'll figure out quickly if I need some help, as if they manage to get the login issue resolved quickly then I might be able to get to it sooner then I thought too. I'll be sure to let you know though.
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Cedarwings
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[Feb 26, 2009 9:19:37 AM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
amoyer

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Yeah! 2007 images are all uploaded!
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Cedarwings
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Cobalt Ocean
Oceanus wrote: 
"I hear Atlantis is all fun and giggles"

[Mar 2, 2009 11:03:11 PM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
Belthazar451

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Nice. Now there's just 2006 to go. So far as I can tell, though, you're gonna have to make the page from scratch - the only page I can find on it is the announcement and winners page.
[Mar 3, 2009 12:35:59 AM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
amoyer

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Thankfully I do have all the images that were rendered thanks to Guppymomma. The only good news about that year is that there are only 200 images. Should make the process a little easier.
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Cedarwings
Captain of the Crew Schmew of the Flag Schmag
Cobalt Ocean
Oceanus wrote: 
"I hear Atlantis is all fun and giggles"

[Mar 3, 2009 12:42:21 AM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
lorkiria

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http://forums.puzzlepirates.com/community/mvnforum/viewthread?thread=33215&offset=0
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"There is no salvation in becoming adapted to a world which is crazy." - Henry Miller
[Mar 3, 2009 7:23:54 AM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
amoyer

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You are the best!
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Cedarwings
Captain of the Crew Schmew of the Flag Schmag
Cobalt Ocean
Oceanus wrote: 
"I hear Atlantis is all fun and giggles"

[Mar 3, 2009 10:53:31 AM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
amoyer

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That's it... I quit! Well... not really, but after another 200 tonight, I'm done uploading all the past rendered egg images. Woot!
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Cedarwings
Captain of the Crew Schmew of the Flag Schmag
Cobalt Ocean
Oceanus wrote: 
"I hear Atlantis is all fun and giggles"

----------------------------------------
[Edit 1 times, last edit by amoyer at Mar 6, 2009 10:47:55 PM]
[Mar 6, 2009 10:45:53 PM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
Belthazar451

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Yay!
[Mar 7, 2009 4:43:55 AM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
Fizz

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The suggestion about the wiki pages for next year is as such:

Having 2 pages to update is time consuming, and I am wondering if it is possible to link the pages. In that when a new entry is created on the {{Flategg|Year|#|Piratename}} page, it creates a matching entry in the 2nd page. I realize the template is different, but if at least the entry was created it would be faster to just edit the page with the proper template {{Rendered|Year|#|Piratename}}.
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Fizz -- RETIRED Senior Officer of Phoenix Warriors, Lady of Tyrs Own
[Mar 14, 2009 8:31:18 PM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
Belthazar451

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You're doing great so far. =)

I've got a thought for how your suggestion might work - gimme a sec to test it out.

Edit: Yup, it works.

Basically my idea is you'd create a dummy page, call it, say... "2009 Design Easter Eggs/Egg data" or something. It's basically the same as the two pages you're doing now, but instead of doing {{Renderegg|2009|4|Fizz}} or whatever, you'd write {{{{{1}}}|2009|4|Fizz}} - that is, replace the template call with a parameter.

Then on the Renderegg page, you'd call it with {{2009 Design Easter Eggs/Egg data|Renderegg}}, and on the Flategg page with {{2009 Design Easter Eggs/Egg data|Flategg}} - this replaces all occurrences of {{{1}}} with Renderegg and Flategg respectively. (I expected this step to work right - I was just unsure as to whether it would parse properly, and it does.)

Examples:
Dummy page
Page in action
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[Edit 2 times, last edit by Belthazar451 at Mar 14, 2009 10:36:50 PM]
[Mar 14, 2009 10:17:27 PM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
Fizz

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Okay.. so, the dummy page would be the only actual page that would get edited? and the rendered and flat pages would both generate off that? and all we'd have to do from there is upload the images?

Can you explain in layman's terms how {{{1}}} seeks out both pages differently?
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Fizz -- RETIRED Senior Officer of Phoenix Warriors, Lady of Tyrs Own
[Mar 15, 2009 1:57:45 AM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
Belthazar451

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Okay.. so, the dummy page would be the only actual page that would get edited? and the rendered and flat pages would both generate off that? and all we'd have to do from there is upload the images?

Yes to all.

 
Can you explain in layman's terms how {{{1}}} seeks out both pages differently?

Essentially, the {{{1}}} is a parameter placeholder - the parameters are the things you put between the pipe symbols in a template call. For example, {{Renderegg}} is a template. If I call the template with {{Renderegg|2009|4|Fizz}}, then the 2009, 4 and Fizz are all parameters - by default, they're numbered in order: 1, 2 and 3.

If you look at the renderegg template page, you'll notice it reads:

{{Renderegg/{{{2}}}|filename={{{3}}}|year={{{1}}}}}

When the wiki software parses this, it inserts the first paramter wherever a {{{1}}} appears, the second wherever a {{{2}}} appears, and the third wherever a {{{3}}} appears, et cetera. So if I insert the parameters from my example above, this becomes:

{{Renderegg/4|filename=Fizz|year=2009}}

(Note this example might be a little confusing, because the Renderegg template actually calls a series of sub-templates depending on what year it is and how many eggs you have. And the sub-templates have named parameters rather than numbered parameters. But you get what I mean, I hope. I can continue the explanation, but I don't think you need to understand nested sub-templates to understand parameters.)

So, getting back to my idea, what I've done is replaced the template name itself with a parameter placeholder. That is, instead of calling {{Renderegg|2009|4|Fizz}}, I'm using {{{{{1}}}|2009|4|Fizz}}.

Move up a layer to the page where I call this pseudo-template, I've got {{:Pagename|Renderegg}}. "Renderegg" here is parameter number 1, so the wiki software inserts it wherever a {{{1}}} appears on the called page, and so we get {{Renderegg|2009|4|Fizz}}.

I'm hoping that was laymanish enough. If not, someone can possibly translate for you. =D
[Mar 15, 2009 3:50:11 AM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
Fizz

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I'm hoping that was laymanish enough. If not, someone can possibly translate for you. =D

Yes.. I think I am following, though, how does it insert Flategg with just the 1 parameter?
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Fizz -- RETIRED Senior Officer of Phoenix Warriors, Lady of Tyrs Own
[Mar 15, 2009 6:12:00 AM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
Belthazar451

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Same deal - you're calling the dummy page with a completely different call, and this time you're inserting "Flategg" as the parameter. So {{:Pagename|Flategg}} would replace every occurrence of {{{1}}} in the page Pagename with "Flategg" just as {{:Pagename|Renderegg}} would replace every occurrence of {{{1}}} in the page Pagename with "Renderegg".

Essentially, your dummy page would be exactly the text of your current Renderegg page (sans the opening blurb) but with {{{1}}} in place of the template name. Then you'd reproduce the list on the Renderegg page by putting {{:Pagename|Renderegg}}, and on the Flategg page by putting {{:Pagename|Flategg}}.

(Mind you, there is a simpler solution - just have everything on one page. Instead of having all the rendered images and all the flat images on separate pages, just have them together. As in Flat1, Render1, Flat2, Render2, etc. It'd require re-doing the templates a little, but it's not too complicated. As to whether it's preferable is another matter altogether. =D )
[Mar 15, 2009 6:36:03 AM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
Fizz

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For myself, I know the load time on the flat image page is much longer than on the rendered egg page. I have cable internet and it would be hell for people on dial up (do people still use that?)

To clarify; there would be 2 dummy pages? One for the flat images and one for the rendered eggs?
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Fizz -- RETIRED Senior Officer of Phoenix Warriors, Lady of Tyrs Own
[Mar 15, 2009 7:32:31 AM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
Belthazar451

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No, one dummy page, on which you do all the editing. You'd wind up with three pages total, but only one page needed to edit. If you look at the code of the test pages I linked to above (push "Edit" to see the source code), that's pretty much exactly how it works, only I've put the rendered eggs and flat eggs one after the other, rather than on separate pages.

1. Dummy page
Let's call it George, so it's clear I'm using a unique name. Here you'd have a full list of all the entrants, written out just as the pages currently look, but with no opening blurb and {{{1}}} in place of the template name. This is the page you do all the editing. Like so:

 
{{TOCright}}

==Pirate1==
{{{{{1}}}|2009|4|Pirate1}}

==Pirate2==
Design 3 does not have enough bananas.
{{{{{1}}}|2009|6|Pirate2}}

==Pirate3==
{{{{{1}}}|2009|1|Pirate3}}

<etc>

Maybe even a <includeonly>'d Category tag at the bottom or something.


2. Renderegg page
Here we call our list of data as though it's a template, using "Renderegg" as parameter number 1. The data will be transcluded, but with all occurrences of "{{{1}}}" replaced by "Renderegg". There's no need to edit this page once it's been created - it just automagically updates when you update the dummy page. Viz:

 
Opening blurb. Welcome to Renderegg page, etc.

----

{{:George|Renderegg}}


3. Flategg page
Exactly the same, only we have a unique opening blurb, and the data page is called using "Flategg" as the parameter instead. Note it's exactly the same data, so exactly the same page, only this time we're replacing "{{{1}}}" with "Flategg" when it gets included. Again, there's no need to edit this page after it gets created. Viz:

 
Opening blurb. Welcome to Flategg page, etc.

----

{{:George|Flategg}}





Including one page inside another doesn't change the one page, meaning we can still include it in other pages. That's the wonder of templates. =)
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[Edit 1 times, last edit by Belthazar451 at Mar 15, 2009 1:21:33 PM]
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Fizz

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I'd like to just say that Belthazar, you rock. I made an edit to the "dummy" page you made.. and I likey. Too bad I didn't think of linking the pages for this seasons pages. heheheh Thanks! I am sure this will make creating the pages next year much faster and easier!
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Fizz -- RETIRED Senior Officer of Phoenix Warriors, Lady of Tyrs Own
[Mar 15, 2009 10:35:17 PM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
Belthazar451

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No problem.

It's not too late to implement it for this year, though possibly a little late for it to be of any use. =)
[Mar 16, 2009 12:36:53 AM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
lesleywalker

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I'd just like to say thanks for the little tutorial on templates, they make more sense to me now. I just have one question.... I take there's a couple of little scripts somewhere called "Renderegg" and "Flategg" that take all the parameters and generate the actual page output - am I correct? What kind of scripts are they and what level of access is required to look at them? I presume they can't be made generally visible for obvious security reasons, but I'm a techie and I like to know how things work. (In a previous life I think I was the cat that got killed by curiosity).
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Cheery - Alchemist, Ankh-Morpork City Watch, Cobalt
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[Mar 16, 2009 6:20:25 PM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
Belthazar451

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They're called templates rather than scripts, and anyone can view them (though you have to be a logged-in user to edit them).

You'll find them at Template:Renderegg and Template:Flategg

The sub-templates is where things get a little complicated. As I noted above, the Renderegg template reads:

{{Renderegg/{{{2}}}|filename={{{3}}}|year={{{1}}}}}

When parsed, the wiki software inserts parameters 1, 2 and 3 where the placeholders are - this is a function of the MediaWiki software itself, and not of the template. I'm reasonably sure it's open source if you want to get a hold of that and inspect how it does thing.

Now, you'll notice once the paramteres have been added, that this template is calling another sub-template. So, say I call the Renderegg template with {{Renderegg|2009|1|Fizz) (i.e. it's 2009 and Fizz has made one egg), when I substitute the values, I get:

{{Renderegg/1|filename=Fizz|year=2009}}

So, this is calling a second template called Template:Renderegg/1. There's a separate sub-template for each number of eggs. I've used the /1 template because it's pretty short... as opposed to (say) the /14 template. =)

So, the /1 template reads:

[[{{Renderegg/{{{year}}}}}{{{filename}}}-1.png]]

Passing in the values from before (note here that the sub-template has named parameters, which were also named in the template call above) we get

[[{{Renderegg/2009}}Fizz-1.png]]

Note, this is calling yet another sub-template, Template:Renderegg/2009. This one simply reads:

Image:Egg-rendered-2009-

So, we've reached the end of our string of sub-templates. Now for the magic of templates, the entire text of the template is back-substituted wherever the template call occurs (this process is called "inclusion" or "transclusion" depending on which part of the wiki you're looking at). So if we substitute this into our /1 sub-template above, we get

[[Image:Egg-rendered-2009-Fizz-1.png]]

which you'll recognise as being an image link. Clever, hey? The higher-numbered sub-templates have links for images two, three, four, and so on, which means that rather than having to type out fourteen image links to get fourteen images, we can just type {{Renderegg|2009|14|Dread Pirate Westley}} and it'll generate all the code itself from substitution of the templates and sub-templates.

The Flategg template and sub-templates are exactly the same, except they have "flat" wherever it says "render" or "rendered".



Possibly an easier way to think of it is as a more powerful version of Word's find/replace function. I've asked it to find every ocurrence of the word {{Renderegg}} on a page and replaced it with a image link. The more powerful bit comes in the parameters. Parameters let you do clever things.
[Mar 16, 2009 6:40:17 PM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
lesleywalker

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<ding!>

Ah, I believe I have it now. The syntax
{{blah}}
means "go and find Template:blah and put its content here" (plus the parameter stuff), and it's recursive, and that's all it needs. Very clever indeed!

Watch out, I'll be requesting templates left and right now. :-)
----------------------------------------
Rumbletum - FO, Crimson Sabers, Colbalt
Cheery - Alchemist, Ankh-Morpork City Watch, Cobalt
Jinxed Idol links
[Mar 19, 2009 10:32:51 PM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
Belthazar451

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Aye. More strictly speaking, the braces mean "insert the page named here" - any page can be included using braces. Simply having the pagename implies the Template namespace (that is, all pages called "Template:Pagename"), but opening with a colon means the main namespace (all the pages with no explicit namespace before the name), while for any other namespace, you simply identify the namespace.

For example, I can include a page from the user namespace with {{User:Username/Pagename}}.

I guess my big wiffly-waffly explanation was a bit of overkill. =)
[Mar 20, 2009 6:04:18 AM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
Fizz

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for lack of a better place to post this:

I'd like to direct the attention to the images of the event eggs in the wiki...

They are wrong and my attempt to correct failed. I am pretty sure I didn't get the size and transparent background right. Someone with more skills will have to create them with transparent bg. Feel free to steal from my images, or steal from ypp tools (which is where I got the images from... and by comparing them to the game, they are right.)

Defleur's
Wiki image:

Correct image:


Joe's
Wiki image:

Correct image:


Merethif's
Wiki image:

Correct image:


Multo's
Wiki image:

Correct image:


Phillite's
Wiki image:

Correct image:

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Fizz -- RETIRED Senior Officer of Phoenix Warriors, Lady of Tyrs Own
[Apr 22, 2009 1:36:54 AM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
Fizz

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I see that eggs were updated, but they still don't display the proper size. Is it just me? http://yppedia.puzzlepirates.com/Eggs
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Fizz -- RETIRED Senior Officer of Phoenix Warriors, Lady of Tyrs Own
[Apr 28, 2009 3:41:32 PM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
Sagacious

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Be sure to bypass your browser's cache by pressing Ctrl + F5 (Internet Exploder and Firefox)
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[Apr 28, 2009 4:18:38 PM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
Fizz

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Be sure to bypass your browser's cache by pressing Ctrl + F5 (Internet Exploder and Firefox)

Even with Ctrl + F5 still shows the eggs smaller than they actually are in game on the page, however, if you click the egg, it shows them the right size on the single egg image page.

Edit: oh and on my egg collection page, they show smaller too.. so it isn't just that wiki page. http://yppedia.puzzlepirates.com/Fizz/Eggs
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Fizz -- RETIRED Senior Officer of Phoenix Warriors, Lady of Tyrs Own
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[Edit 1 times, last edit by Fizz at Apr 28, 2009 4:40:50 PM]
[Apr 28, 2009 4:39:57 PM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
Sagacious

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I think I caught the issue. Some of the images are not perfectly cropped, so they are being shrunk due to the little extra space around the edges. I'll get to fixing them

Fixed. You will need to bypass browser cache to see the new images properly. Joe's egg still looks a little funny - but that is in-line with the other more vertical eggs.
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Cerulean & Meridian - Icemeister
Emerald & Obsidian - incognito!
#TeamPurple
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[Edit 1 times, last edit by Sagacious at Apr 28, 2009 5:08:19 PM]
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Fizz

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Yess! Thanks! It has been bugging me that they weren't quite right. hehe. :D
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Fizz -- RETIRED Senior Officer of Phoenix Warriors, Lady of Tyrs Own
[Apr 28, 2009 7:26:01 PM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
Belthazar451

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*Boink*

I'm guessing from recent edits to the wiki that it's almost egg time again? Do we want to start setting things up as we discussed above? =)
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