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Forums » List all forums » Forum: Obsidian Parley » Thread: Pirate Privilege |
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Thread Status: Normal Total posts in this thread: 24 |
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Hardrockjoe
Joined: Jun 16, 2009 Posts: 46 Status: Offline |
Why do people think grey heavens owe them something? They never signed a contract saying "we must not let X pirate cry". They obviously care about the game and community and don't need to feed your entitlement to show it. Please let the forums be used for real issues and discussion not a circle jerk about cashstacks and "sentimental items" on other oceans. ---------------------------------------- Hardrockjoe on every Ocean Hiding in the shadows on Obsidian Sokol says, "you're magical, Joe!" Madies says, "wow joe!" Mekiko tells ye, "I just want you to know I had a dream about you last night" |
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Crazymg
Joined: Nov 25, 2008 Posts: 575 Status: Offline |
If they cared about the community they would put these "sentimental items" as a factor. And yes "sentimental items" are a real issue when they're a huge part of why you even play the game. *not saying they don't care, could they do more probably. **vagueness is vague so I'll cover all items I can think of. ---------------------------------------- ~Princessmg~ |
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Jcmorgan6
 Joined: Feb 5, 2015 Posts: 413 Status: Offline |
you're three or four months too late posting this ---------------------------------------- Jjc & Jice on Emerald CI booty division stats |
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phamers
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Not having a huge wealth difference between the already wealthy on other oceans is a huge plus for new players and not so rich old players. So not having any link between new and old ocean will keep the ocean fresh and entertaining for the mayority. Some old rich buggers have to start over again, but even that should be a refreshing experience. I think it would even be fun to reset the servers every 5 years or so ---------------------------------------- Holytacobar |
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Sagacious
Joined: Mar 6, 2006 Posts: 4798 Status: Offline |
All games should evolve over time to keep them alive. Puzzle Pirates is no exception. Under Three Rings, the game was taken in several directions mostly heading the same way. Now it's under Grey Havens, more bold moves can be made that perhaps would have been too risky to try while having a larger parent company to answer to. While I completely understand what players feel about having to start afresh and not being able to transfer things over, it is something simply incompatible with the game's future vision to allow such transfers. It would also require development time which is more precious than ever seeing as the development team has shrunk to the smallest it's been since the game was first created. Would players really want no fresh content or updates for a considerable length of time just to facilitate the implementation of a form of heirloom trade system between oceans? It just doesn't make sense. And for every player who really cannot handle starting over and would rather quit playing forever, there will be plenty more players moving, unretiring, or joining the game as a new player. I feel that there are very few players who would genuinely retire over this relatively small inconvenience. ---------------------------------------- Cerulean & Meridian - Icemeister Emerald & Obsidian - incognito! #TeamPurple |
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Scarpath
Joined: Sep 7, 2014 Posts: 246 Status: Offline |
Some things need kept, but when the devs say clean slate... It's a clean slate folks. The old stuff won't show up just cause you paid for it before. You moved to a new server... So it's a new server... They have made clear the ONE object that might have needed to come up, does in fact, not need to come up to this server.(That being the box set item) There will be new things to replace the old. There already HAVE been some new things to replace the old. And as always, Don't like? Don't play. ---------------------------------------- Scarpath on Emerald, Cerulean, and Meridian! Also Scarpath on Obsidian, Defiant to the core. Your grammar should at least be as good as mine, take the time to make it decent! |
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Crazymg
Joined: Nov 25, 2008 Posts: 575 Status: Offline |
When I said they could probably do more I was referring to keeping to box buyers happy, if they really didn't want to do the old version for whatever reason, couldn't they at least give out the updated or the explorers pack at a discounted price? Also just because I collect things on Emerald does not mean I'd want them to be transferred to Obsidian. They're two very different oceans and I like not having to worry about my LE ships sinking every time I go out solo and DC. ---------------------------------------- ~Princessmg~ |
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Lonehwolf
Joined: Dec 20, 2007 Posts: 143 Status: Offline |
The only way I could think of transferring valuable resources to make some sense (with limitations) is to turn it into a game. Take a ship - any size, bigger carries more of course. Load it up with money (hard limit in place) and any interesting cargo, and be able to chart course to a very far away point (aka the destination ocean). Along the way the crew would have to fight against the hardest level threats appropriate to them. If they make it, that ship and all its holdings are not on a different ocean, including the pirates (provided a slot is made available for them, otherwise they're left back on the ocean of origin. Chances of this happening? Probably none, and that's okay, but I wouldn't expect resource transfer to just happen without a challenge attached to it, if it were ever t be a thing, and even then it would have to be limited. ----------------------------------------
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Raalala
Joined: Mar 6, 2008 Posts: 640 Status: Offline |
Sit down. None of us were asking for anything to be transferred to the new ocean, we've all started in the same boat and to be honest, I like it. I'm OPPOSED to them merging/wiping the other oceans/servers. As yes, we have invested a lot of time in them to collecting things that are no longer attainable, this includes anything you can name, trinkets and onwards. Maybe actually read what has been posted rather than creating an irrelevant side thread to a thread that was already dead. Or would you like a bigger wooden spoon to stir with? ---------------------------------------- ~ Bambeh Johnydepp says; 'BatBam, your f-ing play on words fetish' Priapus says; 'Mate, look at his screen, you could play chess on that.' Avatar by Seapint! |
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Nek0jin
Joined: Feb 8, 2004 Posts: 563 Status: Offline |
With regard to the Limited Edition ships (my own personal issue, which I've stated elsewhere), it's my opinion that Grey Havens might have never had the opportunity to buy YPP if Three Rings hadn't offered the LEs. The money that the LEs brought into the game kept the game afloat for longer than it might have otherwise lasted. It's clear that Dark Seas is the way forward for GH, and while they might continue to host the old oceans, it's obvious to everyone that all but one of them are effectively dead at this point. Yes, they've said that they do intend to try to find ways to keep the old seas alive, but that's clearly not their primary concern and interest. I paid for a ship that I never used. Now, this isn't GH's fault, but it would be nice for them to find some way to recognize the support that people have made in the past, and allow for people who have paid real money to buy LE ships, to have some way to move them forward into the more active and evolving version of the game. Do I think that it needs to be a "gift?" No. And while I did ask for the ability to transfer them, I acknowledge that we don't want people with vast fleets in the older version of the game suddenly having a new fleet which they can sell; that would go against the idea of new starts. So attach an in-game cost for it. Giving some way to retrieve these ships without having to spend RL money again would be a good gesture to the faithful. Instead of transferring the ship whole, transfer a ship in a bottle for the base version of that, without any upgrades and modifications that their other version has/had. Simply saying, "That's the old version of the game, use it there," is a disservice to the player base. Those LE ships shrink in numbers as people leave the game permanently. It would be nice to see them sailing again.
This in particular is the worst argument that can be made in any game forum about any game element or change. It's basically saying, "Go away, we don't want to hear you." You're effectively trying to push people out of the game - which is the very opposite of what you should be doing here. You are personally hurting the game you're trying to support. I'll admit that I've been angry enough to make this statement myself in the past, but it's really, really bad for the community no matter who is doing it, or why. Please try to debate better, rather than encouraging people to leave. ---------------------------------------- [Edit 2 times, last edit by Nek0jin at Sep 28, 2017 10:49:05 AM] |
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Hardrockjoe
Joined: Jun 16, 2009 Posts: 46 Status: Offline |
shhhh..... o.o ---------------------------------------- Hardrockjoe on every Ocean Hiding in the shadows on Obsidian Sokol says, "you're magical, Joe!" Madies says, "wow joe!" Mekiko tells ye, "I just want you to know I had a dream about you last night" |
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jdl1963
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If it's not GH's fault, then why do you hold them responsible for making it up to you? Seriously, it seems you're trying to have it both ways - absolving them of responsibility for what happened, while holding them responsible for making up for what happened. |
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Nek0jin
Joined: Feb 8, 2004 Posts: 563 Status: Offline |
GH didn't cause the problems, but they did "inherit" them, both legally and morally, when they bought the company and game wholesale, rather than buying the licensing rights to make their own server/ocean. |
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jdl1963
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o.0 There's no "problem" to inherit - the idea that players should be able to bring items from older oceans is a new one created by the players out of thin air and not based on any precedent. |
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Nek0jin
Joined: Feb 8, 2004 Posts: 563 Status: Offline |
The problem is that players who paid for something are functionally unable to use them. Seriously, what is the harm in allowing for people who previously bought an LE to get a Ship in a Bottle for that on the new server? They still have to pay for a ship, and they're not getting any upgrades or advantages (or, especially, cargo) from the other servers. They would literally be getting a different appearance for a standard ship, and still have to pay in-game for it. |
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jdl1963
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Oh? Did I miss the announcement they were closing the oceans or limiting access to them? No, I did not. There is neither a problem to be fixed nor a wrong to be made right. Nothing that you paid for has been taken away from you. Your ships are still there, and still useable. If you want to sail them, log into the appropriate ocean and character and you're set. |
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Nek0jin
Joined: Feb 8, 2004 Posts: 563 Status: Offline |
... by myself. My old Crew is gone, all long since quit. I'm sure you're eager to do solo excursions, but I am not. Funny how you dodged the question of what harm would come from it, or what advantage I'd be getting. But don't bother responding again. I'm honestly not interested in your opinion, since 1.) you're clearly not interested in anything other than "no," and 2.) the only people whose stance on the matter really matters is GH. So, for that purpose, consider the argument over. You've got your position, I've got mine, and we're not going to get any further. Everyone's staked out their positions, and while I'm interested in discussing ways to do it and make it reasonable, you're clearly not. So let it go. |
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Cutingchris
Joined: Nov 8, 2008 Posts: 83 Status: Offline |
This. I've seen the same people shouting at me that they won't do specific things cause Obsidian is a clean slate for them, but at the same time cry about their renamed LE sloop not being an option to be moved over to Obsidian ---------------------------------------- Magneto - Emerald Cutingchris - |
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Cutingchris
Joined: Nov 8, 2008 Posts: 83 Status: Offline |
LEs probably haven't made OOO as much money as boxes. Even then that's an issue in itself. Boxes have been released for years in regularly scheduled slots (shhhhhh) How do you know? You're looking through a spyglass which is clearly seeing only what you want to see. Unless you've been to Grey Havens' offices and seen their plans and what they've been working on, you just presume: "Nothing happened yet = they don't care about these oceans."
(Just a side note but what were you thinking of, when spending real money on a ship but not getting your money's worth out of it at least?) That for one is an administrative nightmare. How do you distinguish who bought LE ships with real money specifically and those who just bought dubs? You didn't directly spend real money on LE ships, you bought dubs to spend on the game. There's people who have bought dubs with real money, to then sell the dubs to buy familiars/LE pets. Do they deserve to have their items transfered to Obsidian? Administrative nightmare.
That's just yet another vessel for people to build. With people just owning stalls right now, your idea is best suited for when the game is fully established; When people own shoppes and the economy has flourished. Even then, I'd prefer to have new LE ships released in that time.
You'd have the same issue on Obsidian. Only the same players would have the same ships in an economy on a server independent from the base game. Plus, not all LE ship owners have migrated to Obsidian. Many still play Emerald and Cerulean so you'd see even less on Obsidian. It would also be unfair, as these pirates would be able to build their ships, but then sell them. How could people sell them? If you use your idea of a ship in a bottle, then it's like 10-20k initial PoE cost + dubs for a normal sloop to be salvaged. Do people charge others the base price for a sloop, for an LE sloop, for example. Or the price they think they're worth because they're limited edition? I know I wouldn't think about spending upwards of 17m for a Wonderous Xebec on Obsidian from a pirate, when they just got that ship on that ocean for the price of a base Xebec. Even the base price of a Wonderous Xebec to build would be no where near the actual cost. Also with the pirate trade markets being so...erratic as they are, it would be incredibly hard to put a reasonable price these pirates could get their ships. To put it simply, it would be an absolute nightmare for the devs to sort this out. Why bother and just release new ones that would be better suited to this factional system? Yet again the line of "New ocean, new me" comes in handy here. While not as "rude" as this:
It is basically the idea everyone had with this ocean. ---------------------------------------- Magneto - Emerald Cutingchris - |
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Filthyjake
Joined: Jun 14, 2012 Posts: 1115 Status: Offline |
The problum with it is it would be an ultra rare item. Ultra rare items are ultra valuable. It would also be an time consuming and cost the company money. If I buy anything for playstation 1 its not expected to work or be granted in future play station's why is this hard for people to see it has the same name but is not the same game.
Its not reasonable, 1 You think a OM should bottle ships and hand them out? With all the actual issues and launch of the game you think someone on staff has time to answer hundreds of request for ships to be bottled then moved to a new ocean (a feature NOT AVAILABLE on ANY of the OCEANS)? Its even a TOS violation to trade a ship on one ocean for one on a different ocean even if its the exact same ship. 2 I have 20-30 LE's personally that I want, and a Renamed Prize Elf War Frig I won in Christmas in July.... Oh and some trinkets people gave me who are no longer with us. 3 Really you think the value of a normal sloop should yield (salvaged ship ) LE sloop such as a casino that would sell on Emerald for 1m.
You will only accept yes your not interested in the realities that have been shared. ---------------------------------------- Filthyjake all oceans (Obsidian Primary) Filthyjake6145 (discord) ?Retired? On a Break? I found a new love... Casual player or yet another who moved on. |
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Nek0jin
Joined: Feb 8, 2004 Posts: 563 Status: Offline |
Not true. I would accept "Yes" or "No" from the devs, and only the devs. People trying to shut down the conversation by acting like their position is the Devs' position (see the OP of this thread) do nothing to help this. Likewise, trying to argue why it's a bad idea does nothing to further the discussion - it's just a long-winded "no." It's trying to shout down the idea with fake authority. But in the absence of a clear and specific Dev answer, a discussion on how to make it work is far, FAR more productive than a discussion of people saying, "No, it's a terrible idea." For example, your objection that the LEs would be worth huge amounts is a problem, but it's not an insurmountable one. Make the LEs account-bound*, like the permanent Hat and Sword from the Eminent Explorer pack. Voila, it suddenly has no financial leverage. * That is, if they're being given/transferred from old seas, rather than some new method of acquiring them that is open to everyone. |
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Jcmorgan6
Joined: Feb 5, 2015 Posts: 413 Status: Offline |
And then the next guy wants his familiars, and the next guy wants his pets. ---------------------------------------- Jjc & Jice on Emerald CI booty division stats |
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jdl1963
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Quite the contrary - a discussion of the pros and cons *is* a productive discussion. One that doesn't presume any answers and brings all sides of the issue to light. A "discussion" of how to make it work isn't a productive discussion because it rests on the presumption that only one point view has any value. |
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Filthyjake
Joined: Jun 14, 2012 Posts: 1115 Status: Offline |
Oh my mistake you said you wanted a a debate,
---------------------------------------- Filthyjake all oceans (Obsidian Primary) Filthyjake6145 (discord) ?Retired? On a Break? I found a new love... Casual player or yet another who moved on. |
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