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shellyanne



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Making the chat kidproof Reply to this Post
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As a parent I would like some more options for the chat to protect kids. The rest of the game is perfectly kidproof.

Im thinking a parental control menu in the options that can be accessed by using a password. Settings I would like:

The ability to lock down chat completely (sending & receiving) perhaps with the option of specifying exceptions such as the oceanmasters or even individuals if the parent chooses to.
Some kind of new color name or maybe an icon to indicate that you can't talk to these players would be nice so you know they can't hear you. And an autorespond message to tells that they cannot hear your message nor will they be able to respond.

A more advanced nice to have feature could be a chat system similar to the one in Toontown where you select from a list of sentences and words.
For kids this would be the only options in the speech mode list in the lower left corner and it would contain sentences such as "Would you like to swordfight" or "yes" or "no" etc. These could also be chosen as a submenu under tells and vessel. Similarly the only messages that the kid would get is the same messages whether they are chosen from the menu or typed.

I realize there aren't that many kids playing now that these options would cater to, but perhaps there would be if parents knew the game had these options!
[May 21, 2004 9:28:03 AM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
Cleaver
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Re: Making the chat kidproof Reply to this Post
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Right now we explicitly do not support play by children under 14 for exactly these reasons. In the future I would like to offer the features you outline, but unfortunately the legal issues are such that in order to support children playing we would have to receive faxes from parents with signatures, etc. This just isn't viable for us right now, and (aside from children playing with their parents) the younger audience just isn't our focus.
[May 21, 2004 9:33:16 AM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message    http://www.puzzlepirates.com/ [Link]  Go to top 
Silverstar

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Re: Making the chat kidproof Reply to this Post
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Not being anyone in any form of official position, I'd still like to point out that this is a social game, and being unable to participate in the social aspects would significantly affect the game play of those such restricted, and those they had to interact with. It would be difficult, for example, to assist someone in playing the puzzles or helping them get around if talking to them consists of selecting from a few predefined phrases.
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Silvermoon, First Mate, Silver Dragon Trading Company
Silverstar, Instructor, Puzzle Pirates Academy (retired)
[May 21, 2004 9:39:28 AM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message    http://www.livejournal.com/users/chirik    Chirik    yppSilvermoon [Link]  Go to top 
Nikells

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Re: Making the chat kidproof Reply to this Post
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I think the current filtering is very good at omitting foul language, although I can understand wanting even more protection.

I like the idea of only allowing them to talk to "safe" people. Perhaps well mannered child-friendly pirates could be allowed into this restricted chat area by way of voting (If 5 people already specified as safe vote for them they get in.)

Some password protection options for the filter menu would probably be an idea too.

As a side note: most of the people going round trying to bypass the chat filter and generally be a nuisance are likely to be children themselves.

Theres also an age restriction of 13 years for the game. Any child older than that who doesn't know about the things occasionally mentioned in the game obviously didn't go to the same kind of playground I did.
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Nikells - Viridian
[May 21, 2004 9:42:29 AM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message    http://nikells.shackspace.com [Link]  Go to top 
Stinktoe



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Re: Making the chat kidproof Reply to this Post
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Depending on the age of the child, I found ToonTown by Disney to be an excellent MMORPG. The chat is restricted to stock phrases and emotions, and direct chat is only possible with someone you actually know.
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Don Quevegas
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[May 21, 2004 10:00:35 AM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
scumhunter



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My 2 year old often hops into my lap while playing. Everyone in our flag know that when Scumhunter says,"fojaernaioheopiahsd;ld" that its time to reply with,"Hi, Robin."

We have the filters on and with them running only someone determined to swear can. What would be nice is a quick way to turn chat off or to render yourself incapable of receiving chats. But the specifics of that would take a lot of work.
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Me Vs. Thor, or No **** there I was.
[May 21, 2004 11:40:54 AM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message    http://www.chia.net/scumhunter/ [Link]  Go to top 
wnorman



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Re: Making the chat kidproof Reply to this Post
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It'd be nice to add some more variations to the filters, but that's obviously tough to do. There are some common ones I've seen though, t.h.i.s for example.
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Shark
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[May 21, 2004 12:10:11 PM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
davidsinger



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Re: Making the chat kidproof Reply to this Post
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wnorman wrote: 
It'd be nice to add some more variations to the filters, but that's obviously tough to do. There are some common ones I've seen though, t.h.i.s for example.


I have had people trying to bypass the system. All you have to do it tell them that people in this game don't really swear and that we they don't need to do it to look tough. They are normally confused and just want to look tough.
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Ironfisted
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[May 21, 2004 1:00:55 PM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
Amberyl

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Re: Making the chat kidproof Reply to this Post
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Moreover, I'm inclined to feel that younger children should play with a lot of parental supervision. Many of them don't handle fitting well into the game environment otherwise -- a lot of the worst (ban-worthy) behavior we see in-game seems to be unsupervised children and young teens.
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Amberyl, SO, Cult of the Red Mantis, Looterati
Reading the forums a lot is like camping clue. --homullus
[May 21, 2004 1:37:29 PM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message    http://www.black-knight.org/pp/    CyberLWL [Link]  Go to top 
Tee_Beard



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Re: Making the chat kidproof Reply to this Post
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scumhunter wrote: 
My 2 year old often hops into my lap while playing. Everyone in our flag know that when Scumhunter says,"fojaernaioheopiahsd;ld" that its time to reply with,"Hi, Robin."


Aww.

Thesis,
charmed.
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Thesis
It’s kind of funny/sad how I still can find the thing that made me part of Y!PP canon.
[May 22, 2004 1:52:03 AM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
Crystallina

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Re: Making the chat kidproof Reply to this Post
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It's not all about age. I know several teen-aged players who are as mature, at times more mature than older players.
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Rapmasta26, in a surprisingly accurate assessment of many posters' attitude towards things:

 
PLEASE PEOPLE, IF YOU DONT AGREE DONT REPLY!!!!!!!!!!!

[May 22, 2004 10:16:51 AM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message    YPP+Crystallina [Link]  Go to top 
CustardBoy



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Re: Making the chat kidproof Reply to this Post
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Crystallina wrote: 
It's not all about age. I know several teen-aged players who are as mature, at times more mature than older players.


Yeah, but this post is about pre-teens really.
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The Manipulator
[May 22, 2004 11:05:31 AM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
Crystallina

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I've never met any preteen players that I know of, but they still have a capacity for maturity.
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Rapmasta26, in a surprisingly accurate assessment of many posters' attitude towards things:

 
PLEASE PEOPLE, IF YOU DONT AGREE DONT REPLY!!!!!!!!!!!

[May 22, 2004 12:23:42 PM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message    YPP+Crystallina [Link]  Go to top 
54x

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Re: Making the chat kidproof Reply to this Post
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By US law, which the game has to abide by because its server is based there, anyone under 13 can't play. Thus adding features to support that audience is, in effect, mostly a waste of time, despite the fact that you can often get people of that kind of age that are mostly mature enough to play, and ones older that aren't. My old captain used to be 13, and was definately capable of playing the game and mature enough, too.
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Diamondblade, Cartographer, Crimson Tide.
from Midnight.
Dear sir or madam can you read my book, it took me years to write, will you take a look?
[May 22, 2004 12:35:52 PM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message    http://www.mjwhitehead.com/    raasike54    secondlight5454    32987700 [Link]  Go to top 
Talonder

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Yes I must agree with 54x that this idea is redudent and a waste of the devs time. this game has been built like almost every other mmorpg in the Teen range (13+) So asking to make it child proof is asking to make it violate the ToS because it would encourage younger childern to play when they shouldnt. It is similar to (but not as severe) as a macroer asking for botting tools in game to assist them, when they shouldnt be there in the first place.

If you arent 13 you shouldnt be in the game, so there is no need to child proof it.
[May 22, 2004 1:43:02 PM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
NinjaGuy

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54x wrote: 
By US law, which the game has to abide by because its server is based there, anyone under 13 can't play.


Actually, just to clear this up, anyone who is under 13 but has paid for the game, is legally allowed to play. By paying that is a sign of their parent/guardians permission. Any greenies under 13 however, are not allowed, and technically if a greenie ever says they are under 13 you are obligated to complain them immediately, and/or send a tell to an OM, though wiggle room can be given to greenies who seem to show promise.
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Ninjaguy - Captain of the Mad Mutineers, Prince of the Midnight Armada
[May 22, 2004 3:26:32 PM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message    http://www.midnightarmada.com    Istealpants21    Istealpants21 [Link]  Go to top 
Devonin

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Re: Making the chat kidproof Reply to this Post
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But I can have paid, and still be a greenie. In fact, when you buy a new account, by definition you will be a greenie.

So unless we demand a greenie wear pantaloons or something to prove they've subscribed, you can't tell if they have or not.
[Aug 9, 2005 4:00:00 PM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
Shanoyu

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Re: Making the chat kidproof Reply to this Post
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Awesome, I can break out my 5 dots in law specialty internet on my white-wolf character sheet, or something.

IANAL, (yet, got about 8 years to go) but,

I'm pretty sure that COPPA does /not/ prohibit people under 13 from playing. as long as they are subscribers because the Credit Card constituted a valid form of identification for adulthood, last I checked. Has this changed recently? I haven't been keeping up all /that/ well.

On second thought, you'd need some sort of ToS that stated that a subscriber granted authorization for any individual under the age of 13 tow hom he granted the password to use his account and furthermore that they have the permission to grant the information COPPA protects.
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His Holiness, The Dope
[May 22, 2004 5:32:04 PM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
54x

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Re: Making the chat kidproof Reply to this Post
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On second thought, you'd need some sort of ToS that stated that a subscriber granted authorization for any individual under the age of 13 tow hom he granted the password to use his account and furthermore that they have the permission to grant the information COPPA protects.


I don't see a problem with doing this: It should be in parent's interests to be making sure their children are in such an environment, if they are playing, anyway.
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Diamondblade, Cartographer, Crimson Tide.
from Midnight.
Dear sir or madam can you read my book, it took me years to write, will you take a look?
[May 22, 2004 5:41:00 PM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message    http://www.mjwhitehead.com/    raasike54    secondlight5454    32987700 [Link]  Go to top 
Shanoyu

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Re: Making the chat kidproof Reply to this Post
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Yeah same here. The question is really whether or not there has been legislation post COPPA or a reinterpretation of COPPA changing this that isn't extremely well known. I don't believe so, but I could very well be wrong.
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His Holiness, The Dope
[May 22, 2004 5:49:31 PM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
chewyshoe

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Re: Making the chat kidproof Reply to this Post
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My suggestion would be this:


Have two censor's one which is the current censor in place, then have an extremely sensitive censor. The extremely sensitive censor would be turned on by the user, and could be password activated (What i mean is the parent would put on kid block and then enter a password so the kid couldnt change it)


This way one censor could be alot less strict :)
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Funny exam answers | Free online contests
[May 22, 2004 7:36:34 PM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
Amberyl

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Re: Making the chat kidproof Reply to this Post
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I don't think Puzzle Pirates is reasonably playable using a very limited set of dialogue that can be received or sent.

For instance, verbal instructions and explanations are often given on board a ship. They range from explaining how a particular puzzle works, like, "Did you realize you can flip pieces in carp?" to giving orders, like "Target hats first, then cleavers." A huge amount of the game is undocumented, and gameplay wisdom as well as necessary ship orders must all get passed on verbally.

Interaction with other players forms the core of the game, on a variety of levels. Locking down chat pretty much means reducing the game to a handful of contextualized puzzles; someone with limited chat capabilities is going to be a significant liability to a ship's performance and probably extremely frustrating for a commanding officer to deal with.
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Amberyl, SO, Cult of the Red Mantis, Looterati
Reading the forums a lot is like camping clue. --homullus
[May 22, 2004 9:34:57 PM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message    http://www.black-knight.org/pp/    CyberLWL [Link]  Go to top 
scupperer

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Re: Making the chat kidproof Reply to this Post
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As someone who wasted a good 30 minutes to an hour experimenting with the filter, I can say there definitely are some words which were overlooked...

But, there's just no appropriate place to post this list and comparable piratification suggestions!

Either way, there is absolutely no way to make any filter that's capable of obsuring all foul language, especially since the other half of the problem is context and intent. One can make filth out of any word combination in the proper context. "Hey, Lass, care to clean my cannons?" Of course, language use of this sort then does take some modicum of intelligence to decifer, usually the sort of smarts and finesse lacking in people who are intent upon bypassing the filter anyway... and those who do use language in this fashion are usually much more fun to play with, besides, because they aren't overbearing with the brute force of obscenity (but rather the subtle charm of humorous suggestive undertones, and they generally know when it's appropriate). Also, double entendre is something that usually flies over the heads of those under 13 anyway. This is why so many parents have no problem letting their kids watch Shakespeare... ummm... yeah, anyway....

Parental supervision is the best suggestion, of course. That, coupled with a community who will tolerate a harmless moron like me, yet /complain obnoxious people who ruin other people's fun with their behavior makes this probably one of the most, perhaps only, civil on-line gaming communities.

But this also means that, as a parent, you'll also have to monitor the maturity level of your children; which, talking as a parent myself, is a whole lot more difficult than controlling their surroundings.
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I believe that we are all, openly or secretly, struggling against one or another kind of nihilism. - Ellen Willis
[May 22, 2004 10:38:52 PM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message    http://www.scupperer.com [Link]  Go to top 
Mamid



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My 2 year old often hops into my lap while playing. Everyone in our flag know that when Scumhunter says,"fojaernaioheopiahsd;ld" that its time to reply with,"Hi, Robin."


He's 21 months old, hun. Not 2 years yet...

And the scary thing is that he's almost got the sword fight puzzle down and he's starting to figure out the duty puzzles! Mind you, this is while he's sitting in our laps, although I don't have much of one left at the moment. ;)

If we could afford it - and had two more working computers, we'd probably pay for him to play if he was a little bit older - like 5. Of course, one of us would be sitting on one of OUR computer supervising in game and out.

For now, it results in some very unique chat messages.

Other than the odd.. inapropriate comments from some players (who have obviously taken the rum part of the game too seriously) we would recommend it to families. Same provisos though - don't let them play unsupervised etc etc etc...
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When the game isn't fun anymore it is time to stop playing.
[May 23, 2004 2:13:40 AM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
Mamid



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Scummy's sitting behind me brushing my hair out...

"yeah, its teaching him colour and shape recognition. This could result in a whole new spinoff: Preschool Puzzle Pirates! Simplify the puzzles a smidge and voila! Market it to the Sesame Street Crowd."

The scary thing is that this would work! You'd have to take out the rum aspect of the game. Maybe make it either milk and cookies. After all, sailors in 14-18th centuries hated "hard tack" I think it was called. The "bread" they had to eat because it was hard and it was often infested with insects.

But this could be done!
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When the game isn't fun anymore it is time to stop playing.
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tipeon



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Mamid wrote: 
don't let them play unsupervised
Good piece of advice, why not make it a rule?

There are things a computer simply can't do. And educating a kid is certainly not a thing a computer can do. That's the job of a nanny.
A mean a real pirate nanny. Somebody that you trust to take care of your kid when you are not around.

This could be implemented with a nanny list that replace/supplement the hearty list.
The kids would spawn in some bedroom or kindergarten instead of the dock; and only the nanny that agrees to take charge can take him/her out.

Some random ideas:
- passwordless login for kids
- login time and duration logging for parents to check
- new /commands: /follow (to go where the kid is) and /followme (to stop the kid from running away ;-) )
- a nanny prefix to the name of the pirates currently in charge of one (or more) kid(s). Maybe a funny nanny hat/apron.


This "nanny" feature would need substantial change to the user interface and needs some more thinking, but I feel that would be far better than a chat filter.

Any thought?
[May 23, 2004 2:57:10 AM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
Talonder

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tipeon wrote: 
Mamid wrote: 
don't let them play unsupervised
Good piece of advice, why not make it a rule?

There are things a computer simply can't do. And educating a kid is certainly not a thing a computer can do. That's the job of a nanny.
A mean a real pirate nanny. Somebody that you trust to take care of your kid when you are not around.

This could be implemented with a nanny list that replace/supplement the hearty list.
The kids would spawn in some bedroom or kindergarten instead of the dock; and only the nanny that agrees to take charge can take him/her out.

Some random ideas:
- passwordless login for kids
- login time and duration logging for parents to check
- new /commands: /follow (to go where the kid is) and /followme (to stop the kid from running away ;-) )
- a nanny prefix to the name of the pirates currently in charge of one (or more) kid(s). Maybe a funny nanny hat/apron.


This "nanny" feature would need substantial change to the user interface and needs some more thinking, but I feel that would be far better than a chat filter.

Any thought?


THIS GAME DOES NOT CATER TO CHILDERN UNDER 13.
Okay now that I have that out of my system let me explain. This game has been built for a teen raiting has a teen rated game. By making all of these features you are ENCOURAGING younger children to come, which they shouldnt be unless there parent agrees to it anyways.

This is simlar to saying that going to a movie that is rated pg-13. (this is good example.) Anyone is allowed to go see a pg-13 movie, but they should have parental consent. When you go to a pg-13 movie they do swear in it or may have violence, and that is why it has this raiting. Same for YPP it has this raiting because people may swear and it does have some violence (if you could consider sea battles violence). In a movie you do not make an edited verison for the younger kids that want to see it by bleeping out the swears do you? No. Thus YPP shouldnt be focusing on making this game child proof when they should not be playing it.
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[Edit 1 times, last edit by Talonder at May 23, 2004 3:10:47 AM]
[May 23, 2004 3:10:47 AM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
tipeon



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Ouch, my ears.
t'was just an idea, no need to shout.
[May 23, 2004 3:21:36 AM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
Talonder

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I am sorry about that tipeon. I got alittle emontial but I now edited the message. I have no problem with nannies or younger children playing, but right now 3 rings is a very small company and thus they can only do so much at one time. Right now I see so many great ideas that I dont want to see them side tracked by 6 months to place ideas like nannies in. That is all I guess i am saying.
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atteSmythe

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scupperer wrote: 
But, there's just no appropriate place to post this list and comparable piratification suggestions!

Don't know if you're serious or not, here, but it seems a prime candidate for bugs@threerings.net

atteSmythe,
who you think would be refreshed from a tagline-free weekend, but nooooo...
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Attesmythe receives loot: [Gauntlets of Social Responsibility]
Attesmythe receives loot: [Ring of Mandatory Selflessness]

[May 24, 2004 2:26:19 AM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message    http://attesmythe.com [Link]  Go to top 
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