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Shorty_Jack

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Were we wrong?

So something has been on mind recently and I can't seem to figure out if I made a bad decision or not. So I came to the forums for help knowing I'm about to get chewed out for everything below. Note: The decision was not mine alone but from everyone who help with this event.

A certain pirate recieved 3rd place in our Hide and Seek event. She then continued to go around and help out her crewmates find the people they were missing. Now granted I didn't state about people working together, I didn't think I needed too. I just thought that was considering cheating. As mention below, that does come up however I forgot to ask, but then why are people working together allowed to place multiple times? Especially, if they were just going to split the prize.

So please read below to find out what has happened and tell me if I'm wrong. (Don't mind the screenshots it's because I can't figure out the blast logs thingy)
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------






Were we wrong? Did I overract? I still have the 5k and the lump of coal to give to her if I find I myself am wrong. For some reason I just keep hearing "Others cheat in other events (that I don't hold) so why can't I in this one"?
I'm not trying to make anyone's name on here look bad I just want to know if I'm wrong.

-Shortyjack
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Shortyjack of the Midnight Ocean
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[Jul 14, 2006 6:06:57 PM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message    silversleak [Link]  Go to top 
tarajayne

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Re: Were we wrong?

While I think posting a chat log is a little over the top, do I care if you include my name or not, no. Look here for my views.


http://forums.puzzlepirates.com/community/mvnforum/viewthread?p=693725#693725
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Bridalgirl

I get around.
[Jul 14, 2006 6:23:05 PM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
natan_j



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Re: Were we wrong?

I, personally, I think you were wrong. You promised a prize, and did not mention in the rules that you could not help out others, as you admitted. Because what she did was not against any of the written rules, you should honour your promise, and give her the prize to do with as she pleases. Next time, make sure you cover everything in the rules, if there is a next time.

P.S. I feel that many people would've broken that rule if you had put it in, usually greenies can be quite stupid.
P.P.S. I'm not calling the third place winner a greenie.
[Jul 14, 2006 6:23:49 PM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
IantheKorean

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Re: Were we wrong?

 
Now granted I didn't state about people working together, I didn't think I needed too. I just thought that was considering cheating.



You're wrong. Honestly, I'd really like a link to the events thread, so I could see the rules exactly myself, but if you didn't implicitly state that teamwork was disallowed, I don't see where the user in question was at fault. Again, thats just my opinion based off of what you've provided.
[Jul 14, 2006 6:24:33 PM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
Thews



Joined: Dec 8, 2005
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Re: Were we wrong?

I replied to the other thread, didnt know this one existed.

It seems to me, the sprit of a greenie is getting help from other people. When I look at the rules, I expect that sense ye can ask the hiders for help, ye certianly must be able to ask other people for help.

It seems to me that shouting to the Island "has anyone seen so and so" and having someone tell you yeah, they are over here wouldent be cheeting and would be a very greenie thing to do.

And also, sense it is a greenie weekend, and people are acting like greenies, ye ceartinaly cant expect them to get everything right. Greenies never understand the rules unless laied out super super clearly. I mean, if I tell my ship to team, i dont expect the greenies to do it. So how, if ye dont tell greenies, or people acting like greenies, how to team or not team in an event like this do ye expect them to know what to do? And how can ye punish em for doin the wrong thing?
[Jul 14, 2006 6:25:18 PM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
tarajayne

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Re: Were we wrong?

 
I, personally, I think you were wrong. You promised a prize, and did not mention in the rules that you could not help out others, as you admitted. Because what she did was not against any of the written rules, you should honour your promise, and give her the prize to do with as she pleases. Next time, make sure you cover everything in the rules, if there is a next time.

P.S. I feel that many people would've broken that rule if you had put it in, usually greenies can be quite stupid.
P.P.S. I'm not calling the third place winner a greenie.



hehe even if you were calling me a greenie... that's part of the contests this weekend too... I'm supposed to act like a greenie...
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Bridalgirl

I get around.
[Jul 14, 2006 6:27:21 PM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
Shorty_Jack

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Re: Were we wrong?

I will tak your advice into consideration but I would like to hear from the folks I know that live on these forums. Also 5? five people!? There were around 20 that entered? And 5 were working with you?!!

Also, I never planned on giving 4+ place prizes I did it cause I had them. Everyone got something different. One being a chair wish are like 500 poe at most.

Continue to bash my name Bridalgirl you are doing a good job so far, while I was just asking for help to see if I should give you you're prize, but now being on the verge of quitting this game (and not just because of you other things too) I'm about to say screw it you don't deserve it because I don't like you.

You've entered contests with me before and won now that I recall and you got your prize. So a flat out lie to my face saying you don't win anything is bs and you know it. Sorry other cheaters win other events (that I don't run) it sucks, deal with it. I should not expect a captain to act this way. Side note: Tell your Senior Officers to not beg. I do not give poe to beggars!

:P
-Shortyjack

Link is here: http://forums.puzzlepirates.com/community/mvnforum/viewthread?thread=40335
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Shortyjack of the Midnight Ocean
Avatar Shoppe
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[Edit 1 times, last edit by Shorty_Jack at Jul 14, 2006 6:31:44 PM]
[Jul 14, 2006 6:30:38 PM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message    silversleak [Link]  Go to top 
tarajayne

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Re: Were we wrong?

 
I will tak your advice into consideration but I would like to hear from the folks I know that live on these forums. Also 5? five people!? There were around 20 that entered? And 5 were working with you?!!

Also, I never planned on giving 4+ place prizes I did it cause I had them. Everyone got something different. One being a chair wish are like 500 poe at most.

Continue to bash my name Bridalgirl you are doing a good job so far, while I was just asking for help to see if I should give you you're prize, but now being on the verge of quitting this game (and not just because of you other things too) I'm about to say screw it you don't deserve it because I don't like you.

You've entered contests with me before and won now that I recall and you got your prize. So a flat out lie to my face saying you don't win anything is bs and you know it. Sorry other cheaters win other events (that I don't run) it sucks, deal with it. I should not expect a captain to act this way. Side note: Tell your Senior Officers to not beg. I do not give poe to beggars!

:P
-Shortyjack

Link is here: http://forums.puzzlepirates.com/community/mvnforum/viewthread?thread=40335


Right ok, tell me what contest I've been in with you. I've never met you before today. For two. My senior officer happend to be in this whole GREENIE weekend contest you claim to be running all weekend. Greenies ask for poe, we were acting like greenies. I came into your house and asked to b a roommate, everyone laughed. Why are you bashing my SO's?
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Bridalgirl

I get around.
[Jul 14, 2006 6:34:42 PM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
Shorty_Jack

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Re: Were we wrong?

 
 
Now granted I didn't state about people working together, I didn't think I needed too. I just thought that was considering cheating.



You're wrong. Honestly, I'd really like a link to the events thread, so I could see the rules exactly myself, but if you didn't implicitly state that teamwork was disallowed, I don't see where the user in question was at fault. Again, thats just my opinion based off of what you've provided.

I see what you mean and that is why I posted this. As for the I made it a waste of time thing... deal with it....

If she and her 5 helpers won then would it have been alright to only give all them the same place? Or would I have to give the others placement prizes because I didn't state teamwork?

Either way, I'm done. I'm not running anymore events because you always have one person bitch about it not going there way and well I'm sick of it.

Oh did I also mention that while Bridalgirl is ruining my name on the forums because sweetie you can't ruin it in game... I wasn't the only one to make this decision?
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Shortyjack of the Midnight Ocean
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[Jul 14, 2006 6:35:35 PM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message    silversleak [Link]  Go to top 
natan_j



Joined: Sep 3, 2005
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Re: Were we wrong?

Hmm, so I'm supposed to act like a greenie to win the prizes?
|0|, |1k3, 1 n3v3r th0t 1d 5t00p 50 |0w 1n m3 3nt1r3 |1f3
0mg0sh0mg0sh0mg0sh0mg0sh0mg0sh
Actually, I'd rather keep my sensibilities about me when winning prizes for myself and others.
Also, I agree again with Bridalgirl. You clearly stated that the contest was for greenies, and then you punish some people for begging?
An appropriate metaphor for the situation: A person hosts a dog show competition, and then kicks some dogs out for barking.
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[Edit 1 times, last edit by natan_j at Jul 14, 2006 6:43:39 PM]
[Jul 14, 2006 6:36:52 PM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
tarajayne

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Re: Were we wrong?

Oh, my crew tells me to say that the people that were helping weren't necesarily in the contest.

We were not trying to win double prizes here.
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Bridalgirl

I get around.
[Jul 14, 2006 6:37:06 PM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
tarajayne

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Re: Were we wrong?

 

Oh did I also mention that while Bridalgirl is ruining my name on the forums because sweetie you can't ruin it in game... I wasn't the only one to make this decision?



Ok, if you say so. I don't know how I'm ruining your name. Just because I posted about it. You in fact posted too, not knowing I had already. I in fact never once said your name. I responded to the actual event thread, since it was an issue with the event.
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Bridalgirl

I get around.
[Jul 14, 2006 6:42:24 PM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
Shorty_Jack

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Re: Were we wrong?

Damn you know I have met you before and I actually wrote it all out too but I got the ERROR! thing. And being too lazy to type it up again.... :P

-Shortyjack
[note: the :P are playful not rude or mean]
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Shortyjack of the Midnight Ocean
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[Jul 14, 2006 6:43:21 PM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message    silversleak [Link]  Go to top 
tarajayne

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Re: Were we wrong?

Sorry, don't remember ever meeting you.
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Bridalgirl

I get around.
[Jul 14, 2006 6:45:11 PM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
Velariel

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Re: Were we wrong?

 
I, personally, I think you were wrong. You promised a prize, and did not mention in the rules that you could not help out others, as you admitted. Because what she did was not against any of the written rules, you should honour your promise, and give her the prize to do with as she pleases. Next time, make sure you cover everything in the rules, if there is a next time.



Ditto. If it's not written in the rules, it can't be against the rules.
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Tacita of Midnight.
Half blind, crippled, and Damned.
[Jul 14, 2006 6:45:47 PM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
natan_j



Joined: Sep 3, 2005
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Re: Were we wrong?

However, I'd like to let Bridalgirl know that ruining another person's good name on the forums is not the best way to handle the situation. One better way would be to hire a mediator, such as myself.
I'll charge you 500 PoE (about 5%) if you win this case. :)
[Jul 14, 2006 6:48:54 PM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
tarajayne

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Re: Were we wrong?

Thanks to those that responded with your support so far. I was quite upset about this, and I dont know how this will continue, but just to know that I got some support really makes me feel better.

/me goes to pillage in happiness now
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Bridalgirl

I get around.
[Jul 14, 2006 6:50:00 PM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
tarajayne

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Re: Were we wrong?

 
However, I'd like to let Bridalgirl know that ruining another person's good name on the forums is not the best way to handle the situation. One better way would be to hire a mediator, such as myself.
I'll charge you 500 PoE (about 5%) if you win this case. :)


Again I don't know how i ruined anything. She posted the conversation in which I attempted to resolve it in person before coming here. And actually said, if I wasn't satisfied to take it to the forums.

And on your part about winning, knowing even that there are a few people out there, apart from my own crew, that support me, that to me is winning. The actual prizes are in her care so it's highly unlikely i'll get them, since she already said she was going to screw it because she didn't like me.
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Bridalgirl

I get around.
[Jul 14, 2006 6:53:17 PM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
Shorty_Jack

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Re: Were we wrong?

 
 

Oh did I also mention that while Bridalgirl is ruining my name on the forums because sweetie you can't ruin it in game... I wasn't the only one to make this decision?



Ok, if you say so. I don't know how I'm ruining your name. Just because I posted about it. You in fact posted too, not knowing I had already. I in fact never once said your name. I responded to the actual event thread, since it was an issue with the event.


Um that's my point exactly, you posted on a thread with an issue of the event. I understand that. Do you really believe people on these forums won't expect it was for the op? Really mate.

Also, I guess I'm being proven wrong here, kind of knew I would be since this is the forums and the rule is agrue with the OP. Anyway, I still would like to hear what others have to say.

We were looking out for those that don't have connections in the game to have 5 people on their "team". Having outside to me is just worse. You also stated that their weren't in the contest. So 4th place (and thankfully there was no prize for that) finished because of your help. You being in the contest them being in the contest, I didn't state it but don't you think that's unfair? Am I the only one who sees that as being unfair? Guess so.

-Shortyjack
If the majority of this thread thinks I am wrong for not writing you can NOT use teams in a game of hide and seek where only the top 3 players would be issued prizes, then I will give you your prize. I basically don't understand why I'm wrong and that's what I'm looking for here. So far all I'm getting is cause you accidently left it out of the rules. Hm.. now to get everyone else to change their minds...
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Shortyjack of the Midnight Ocean
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[Jul 14, 2006 6:56:22 PM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message    silversleak [Link]  Go to top 
Velariel

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Re: Were we wrong?

 


Also, I guess I'm being proven wrong here, kind of knew I would be since this is the forums and the rule is agrue with the OP.



That has nothing to do with it. The point of the forums is to give your opinion about what you think is right/good. Changing the rules of a game after it's over is not right. If in the rules it stated teamwork was a no-no, then I'd be arguing for you. It was not. By the chat log that was posted, it seems clear to me that it was a rule introduced after the event was over.

 


We were looking out for those that don't have connections in the game to have 5 people on their "team". Having outside to me is just worse. You also stated that their weren't in the contest. So 4th place (and thankfully there was no prize for that) finished because of your help. You being in the contest them being in the contest, I didn't state it but don't you think that's unfair? Am I the only one who sees that as being unfair? Guess so.



Then maybe next time you ought to put it in the rules to begin with. It was probably an oversight on your flag's part, but at the same time players shoudl not be punished by an oversight that is not their fault.

Yes, in hide and seek it's best for each person to go it alone. But I cannot fault bridal or anyone else who may have gotten help for doing it because it was not stated in the rules. Should it have been? Probably. Was it? No.

She won, using a method that was not against the rules. She deserves whatever prize she won.
----------------------------------------
Tacita of Midnight.
Half blind, crippled, and Damned.
[Jul 14, 2006 7:08:56 PM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
natan_j



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Re: Were we wrong?

You will have absolutely no chance of changing my mind, as anyone can clearly see that you did not actually write a rule about there being no teams allowed. This is now officially a technicality case.

Technicalities win a large portion of law suits every year, so you'd better get used to it, and protect yourself on every angle. The reason technicalities win out is because the 'sued' did not cover themselves completely.
[Jul 14, 2006 7:09:16 PM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
Thews



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Re: Were we wrong?

http://www.neosporin.com/print50tips.htm

#39 team hide and seek... I have played it as a kid. Its not unreasonable to think that teams are allowed.

It says you can play in teams... ... ... FWIW
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[Edit 2 times, last edit by Thews at Jul 14, 2006 7:15:03 PM]
[Jul 14, 2006 7:12:23 PM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
tarajayne

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Re: Were we wrong?

[quote]

We were looking out for those that don't have connections in the game to have 5 people on their "team". Having outside to me is just worse. You also stated that their weren't in the contest. So 4th place (and thankfully there was no prize for that) finished because of your help. You being in the contest them being in the contest, I didn't state it but don't you think that's unfair? Am I the only one who sees that as being unfair? Guess so.

/quote]

Hardly a point seenigs how like you said, it was a prizeless place. Second of all, I bring back up Thews's point again... You were allowed/encouraged to be a greenie and ask the hiders for help... why would you be able to get help from others. I'd think that's way more fair then getting help from hiders.
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Bridalgirl

I get around.
[Jul 14, 2006 7:17:37 PM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
Sagacious

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Re: Were we wrong?

Just because it wasn't in the rules, doesn't mean it was permitted. Since it's your event and it's coming out of your own (maybe the crew/flag's?) back pocket - you have right to refuse giving out the prize. Since they didn't lose anything by entering - they can't complain they get nothing.
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Cerulean & Meridian - Icemeister
Emerald & Obsidian - incognito!
#TeamPurple
[Jul 14, 2006 7:18:06 PM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
tarajayne

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Re: Were we wrong?

 
http://www.neosporin.com/print50tips.htm

#39 team hide and seek... I have played it as a kid. Its not unreasonable to think that teams are allowed.

It says you can play in teams... ... ... FWIW



Sorry for the 2948372398234 replies I just think so many people are bringing up good points!

Totally as a kid, when we'd find one person we'd go work together to find the next.... unless we were playing in a specific way then we'd clearly state the rules beforehand, of course.
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Bridalgirl

I get around.
[Jul 14, 2006 7:20:29 PM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
Thews



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Re: Were we wrong?

 
Just because it wasn't in the rules, doesn't mean it was permitted. Since it's your event and it's coming out of your own (maybe the crew/flag's?) back pocket - you have right to refuse giving out the prize. Since they didn't lose anything by entering - they can't complain they get nothing.


Whoa... if all events wouldent give prized to winners just because they didnt like them, events would cease to happen on the oceans! That would be like having a free event, advertising a 50k prize, but only giving it out if someone from yer own flag won.
[Jul 14, 2006 7:20:52 PM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
BenjeminR

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Re: Were we wrong?

Sounds to me like there isn’t only one person who is wrong in this situation.

Bridal- although you didn't go against the rules you are certainly against the “spirit of the event” and general rules of fair play

Shorty- it sucks when you give people to much credit and assume that common sense about cheating will prevail. In this case it did not, I suggest you learn from the mistake and make sure next time you hold a great event that the rules that you assume people would just know are expressly stated.
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Legacee
[Jul 14, 2006 7:22:19 PM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
tarajayne

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Re: Were we wrong?

 
Just because it wasn't in the rules, doesn't mean it was permitted. Since it's your event and it's coming out of your own (maybe the crew/flag's?) back pocket - you have right to refuse giving out the prize. Since they didn't lose anything by entering - they can't complain they get nothing.


Sure did, lost a lot of good pillaging time.

:)
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Bridalgirl

I get around.
[Jul 14, 2006 7:22:44 PM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
natan_j



Joined: Sep 3, 2005
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Re: Were we wrong?

However, by setting up a contest, he must honour his prize offers. He should not discriminate against anyone. He currently has three options:
1. Give the promised prize to Bridalgirl to make it fair.
2. Take away prizes from everyone to make it fair.
3. Have a re-match, and make sure to update the rules.
Of course, there is a fourth option of not doing anything, but that tends to generate a horrible reputation, and you wouldn't want that, would you?
[Jul 14, 2006 7:23:04 PM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
Sagacious

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Re: Were we wrong?

 

Bridal- although you didn't go against the rules you are certainly against the "spirit of the event" and general rules of fair play

QFT
----------------------------------------
Cerulean & Meridian - Icemeister
Emerald & Obsidian - incognito!
#TeamPurple
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