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Filthyjake

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Shutting Down Shops Reply to this Post
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First off I am only speaking for me not anyone else.

At some point in this game were going to have to stop the closing of the shops as soon as the island is taken.

For the health of the game not because its war but if and when people finally get to order a ship from the player run shops. Right now its not a good idea nor a safe one for the purchaser or the shop keepers.

There is zero reason to build any shop other then Shipyards as every thing else can be done through a stall at the almost the same opening cost. Shop=3 Stalls. There is little reason for any player to buy a plot or open a shop its not worth the cost or the risk. Shop cost 30 dubs, can be closed stalls cost 10 dubs and can't they lack storage and pay a slightly higher rent, but compared to being closed and dusted the safety is worth the price in my opinion.

Its time to think about the game and who we support in it. If we want the war to end all wars and the game to end were on the right track to do so. Every time a flag wins they shut down the shops, its their right but in the end is it the best for the game. We have 25 days left to get casino war frigs out to the ocean, and dark shipyards.

Monarchs find a way to work things out so the ocean can have a solid healthy economy, not dark buildings.
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Filthyjake all oceans (Obsidian Primary)
Filthyjake6145 (discord)

Who would have ever thought there would be a more worthless familiar then the Krackling's? But now we have owls that are farm raised.

Which ever way the wind blows...
[Aug 5, 2018 5:15:23 PM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
Kyura94

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Re: Shutting Down Shops Reply to this Post
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We have 25 days left to get casino war frigs out to the ocean, and dark shipyards.
Monarchs find a way to work things out so the ocean can have a solid healthy economy, not dark buildings.
It's not so simple.

It's limited edition, and people place value on that. Your frustration in this post suggests you want one Casino WF too.

Now, if you were the Monarch of the winning flag of a kade, would you not want to control a SY? You guarantee 1 for yourself, and are in a powerful/profitable position to produce more to sell to the ocean.

If you can simultaneously shutdown others and kill off the other producers, why not? Those owners weren't going to support you in the next kade anyway. It's not just the LE ship either. If you consider war fleets, it's only logical to shut down opposing SYs.

You want altruism so you get your Casino WF, but you also want a "solid healthy economy". While these 2 ideas aren't mutually exclusive, there's probably little overlap.
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Ryuken on Obsidian (active) and Emerald (not really)
I made an in-depth Distilling guide here, and a guns one somewhere.
I gave Obsidian their Owls c:
[Aug 5, 2018 6:55:45 PM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
Thunderbird

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Re: Shutting Down Shops Reply to this Post
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Keep in mind that one only needs to order the LE ship before the month ends. Once the order is in the queue, it can be completed, even if the ship becomes unavailable for purchase before that happens.
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[Aug 5, 2018 7:09:00 PM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
Filthyjake

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Re: Shutting Down Shops Reply to this Post
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Keep in mind that one only needs to order the LE ship before the month ends. Once the order is in the queue, it can be completed, even if the ship becomes unavailable for purchase before that happens.


and if the ship isn't finished before they dust well it doesn't.

Allowing other SY to run doesn't' prevent you building if their are open plots. It does guarantee you will likely see at least 2 kades which is a positive of course there is the scuttle possibility. If done on the 2 week it would gaurentee the dusting so basically only one week to get the shops back.

 
You want altruism so you get your Casino WF, but you also want a "solid healthy economy". While these 2 ideas aren't mutually exclusive, there's probably little overlap


I think it was a premature launch every one who has means should be able to place the order. It was very nice of CIS to give KTP the deeds to SY so they could build Casino Frigs and take orders. Its sad the developers of this game seem to lack for-site in decisions such as launching a popular LE ship when there were 3 Shipyards that could build them.

My issue isn't what happened on Melsner alone but the same has been happening over and over at the end of every kade. I just don't see it as healthy for the ocean. As one who enjoys shop keeping I stated way back early testing that I thought the design was to harsh for shop keepers. I still feel the same, and if they expand it to stalls it would be interesting but also devastating for trade and prices of stock.
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Filthyjake all oceans (Obsidian Primary)
Filthyjake6145 (discord)

Who would have ever thought there would be a more worthless familiar then the Krackling's? But now we have owls that are farm raised.

Which ever way the wind blows...
[Aug 5, 2018 7:25:04 PM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
wrs1864b

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Re: Shutting Down Shops Reply to this Post
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There is zero reason to build any shop other then Shipyards as every thing else can be done through a stall at the almost the same opening cost. Shop=3 Stalls. There is little reason for any player to buy a plot or open a shop its not worth the cost or the risk. Shop cost 30 dubs, can be closed stalls cost 10 dubs and can't they lack storage and pay a slightly higher rent, but compared to being closed and dusted the safety is worth the price in my opinion.

That has been my claim since the shop dusting for obsidian was first announced by GH. However, there have been other shop types made on malanaster. I may well be proven wrong, only time will tell.

From what I can tell, there hasn't been any shops sold to the new governor, something that could put both the buyer and seller ahead. The current shop owner will get *some* poe, and the buyer will get the shop quicker and without the building costs. Again, time will tell if this becomes the norm or not.

If selling shops to the new gov becomes the norm, few shops may actually dust.
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Algol can not assert the truth of all statements in this post and still be consistent.
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[Edit 1 times, last edit by wrs1864b at Aug 6, 2018 6:51:38 AM]
[Aug 6, 2018 5:24:52 AM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
Filthyjake

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Re: Shutting Down Shops Reply to this Post
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However, there have been other shop types made on malanaster. I may well be proven wrong, only time will tell.


No if you math it out the stalls produce more and are less expensive to open and are safe.

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Filthyjake all oceans (Obsidian Primary)
Filthyjake6145 (discord)

Who would have ever thought there would be a more worthless familiar then the Krackling's? But now we have owls that are farm raised.

Which ever way the wind blows...
[Aug 6, 2018 8:08:59 AM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
majestrate

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Re: Shutting Down Shops Reply to this Post
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Taking off my Parley hat and putting on my GD hat

I supported the dusting of shoppes when it was announced and I still do. Even if it doesn't succeed in getting merchant flags involved in politics/blockading, it does provide incentive for the flag owning the shoppe(s) to try and re-take the island within a shortened window.

Though I do still think that there should be a game mechanic that gives shoppe owners the option to payoff (bribe) the winning flag into letting you keep your shoppe open for a set additional amount of time. And that bribe amount would be controlled by the winning flag (the bribe offer should also be able to be rejected on a per-shoppe basis)
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We can't rely on majestrate he yells at people

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can you add another quote to your signature? "Maj is a liability on the forums. Someone stop him"

[Aug 6, 2018 9:54:04 AM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message    first_majestrate    majestrait [Link]  Go to top 
Filthyjake

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Re: Shutting Down Shops Reply to this Post
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Taking off my Parley hat and putting on my GD hat

I supported the dusting of shoppes when it was announced and I still do. Even if it doesn't succeed in getting merchant flags involved in politics/blockading, it does provide incentive for the flag owning the shoppe(s) to try and re-take the island within a shortened window.

Though I do still think that there should be a game mechanic that gives shoppe owners the option to payoff (bribe) the winning flag into letting you keep your shoppe open for a set additional amount of time. And that bribe amount would be controlled by the winning flag (the bribe offer should also be able to be rejected on a per-shoppe basis)


I believe this is the fix and the winning flag can profit from the bribes, not lose in lost taxes which are way to low to worry about anyway. My biggest issue I see is the 14 days makes it possible to force a dusting by wining one kade via a skuttle.

Say the flag skuttles the island week 1 and lets the BK take it. Yes there are possibilities to 3p a BK kade but those can be much more difficult and could be the only shot at gaining the island back. On the other hand the ocean probably sells way more stone then any other ever will.
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Filthyjake all oceans (Obsidian Primary)
Filthyjake6145 (discord)

Who would have ever thought there would be a more worthless familiar then the Krackling's? But now we have owls that are farm raised.

Which ever way the wind blows...
[Aug 6, 2018 10:23:13 AM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
wrs1864b

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Re: Shutting Down Shops Reply to this Post
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However, there have been other shop types made on malanaster. I may well be proven wrong, only time will tell.


No if you math it out the stalls produce more and are less expensive to open and are safe.

Your math is missing key things like the value people place on having a shop. Shops show up more prominently on your pirate page. There are products that shops can make "immediately" that require a wait on even deluxe stalls. They can be selected off the island, without having to go to a bazaar and then select your store off a long list. You can transfer the deed. You can choose your name. You have more manager slots.

Some players may well value things like that for 500k-1M PoE, so buying a shop for 300k means you are way ahead right off the bat. *YOU* might not value shops that much, I know I certainly don't, but there are people that do.

Will those advantages of shops outweigh the risks? As I said, only time will tell if other people put the PoE where their mouths are.
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Algol can not assert the truth of all statements in this post and still be consistent.
[Aug 6, 2018 12:58:58 PM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
Filthyjake

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Re: Shutting Down Shops Reply to this Post
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However, there have been other shop types made on malanaster. I may well be proven wrong, only time will tell.


No if you math it out the stalls produce more and are less expensive to open and are safe.

Your math is missing key things like the value people place on having a shop. Shops show up more prominently on your pirate page. There are products that shops can make "immediately" that require a wait on even deluxe stalls. They can be selected off the island, without having to go to a bazaar and then select your store off a long list. You can transfer the deed. You can choose your name. You have more manager slots.

Some players may well value things like that for 500k-1M PoE, so buying a shop for 300k means you are way ahead right off the bat. *YOU* might not value shops that much, I know I certainly don't, but there are people that do.

Will those advantages of shops outweigh the risks? As I said, only time will tell if other people put the PoE where their mouths are.



I also didn't put in commodity cost in either. Yes value is clearly in the eye of the player look at LE ships, Fams, Clothing ect. However from a practical standpoint the only Shop needed is the Ship Yard to the best of my knowledge as its the only Shop needed to produce certain products with immediate delivery. Stalls can produce every other product in the game.
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Filthyjake all oceans (Obsidian Primary)
Filthyjake6145 (discord)

Who would have ever thought there would be a more worthless familiar then the Krackling's? But now we have owls that are farm raised.

Which ever way the wind blows...
[Aug 6, 2018 1:15:53 PM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
Grinfish

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Re: Shutting Down Shops Reply to this Post
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Taking off my Parley hat and putting on my GD hat

...

Though I do still think that there should be a game mechanic that gives shoppe owners the option to payoff (bribe) the winning flag into letting you keep your shoppe open for a set additional amount of time. And that bribe amount would be controlled by the winning flag (the bribe offer should also be able to be rejected on a per-shoppe basis)


You could call it something snappy, like, I dunno, a Fandango System? :D

No need to hard code such a thing really, as it can be done by simple negotiation.
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[Aug 6, 2018 2:33:32 PM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
Filthyjake

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Re: Shutting Down Shops Reply to this Post
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No need to hard code such a thing really, as it can be done by simple negotiation


Because people are so honest to their word, I prefer a button that I press to unlock my shop, this would also make life easier for the governor not needing to be on, they set the bribe offer when they close the shop. If I take the deal i hit the button, if not i could have a discussion to reopen the shop.
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Filthyjake all oceans (Obsidian Primary)
Filthyjake6145 (discord)

Who would have ever thought there would be a more worthless familiar then the Krackling's? But now we have owls that are farm raised.

Which ever way the wind blows...
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[Edit 1 times, last edit by Filthyjake at Aug 6, 2018 3:19:42 PM]
[Aug 6, 2018 3:17:52 PM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
majestrate

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Re: Shutting Down Shops Reply to this Post
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You could call it something snappy, like, I dunno, a Fandango System? :D

No need to hard code such a thing really, as it can be done by simple negotiation.

I'd consider it to be more of a trade action than a /pay action. Is there anything NF didn't try to do way back when? ;)
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#TeamEvil
Marto wrote: 
We can't rely on majestrate he yells at people

Vas wrote: 
can you add another quote to your signature? "Maj is a liability on the forums. Someone stop him"

[Aug 7, 2018 1:15:48 PM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message    first_majestrate    majestrait [Link]  Go to top 
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