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Lolcaatz

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The ban system is pretty harsh, I think I'm never allowed to play this game again it's not really that disciplinary, it's just one strike and your out kinda thing. anyway just a banned person's thoughts ;D...

YPP IRL would be like if you had stolen money from your boss at your job, now you go to jail for life and lose everything you had you'll never get to rejoin society and if we catch you outside of jail we'll instantly throw you back in and take away everything you own (again). Basically you don't even get a chance to pay the people back that you stole from.

Now whether or not you're a non-banned member reading this or just another banned kid on the street, you can't deny the truth. While they are The Rules...

All I'm saying is that, they don't have a positive affect on the community, I would love to rejoin the game if I could and I believe so would a lot of other banned players, not to be destructive, but I wanna play the game for what it is again! have fun! increase the economy! make friends! and I'm sure a lot of other banned players share the same passion.

The Rules need to be changed IMO, I had made a lot of friends in this game while I was on it, I'm assuming some of them quit when I was banned for stealing. I'm sure a lot of people quit...

I was foolish I thought that If I won in poker I could pay back all my friends shiphold's and give them extra even, well I didn't I took their loot and lost that aswell, anyways I guess the love of money is dangerous.

I think the problem this community has in result to people who are banned is that you can't see the mistake for what it is, rather you just condemn us.

I hope you think about what I've said OM's
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[Edit 2 times, last edit by Lolcaatz at Jun 18, 2017 2:25:16 AM]
[Jun 17, 2017 10:20:51 AM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
mikipiki



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Re: banned and I think it's a final goodbye Reply to this Post
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You haven't exactly said what you did. But from reading imbetween the lines, I'm guessing you stole poe from hearties/crewbies to poker, under the assumption you'd make a profit...

Even if you think the rules are strict, they are the rules, by playing the game you agree to them and if you break them there's no reason as to why you shouldn't be dealt the punishment.

To be honest, for doing something like that a permanent ban is a fair punishment. It seems that now you're simply upset because your whole masterplan, which was stupid, fell apart and you have to face the consequences...

That's just the cold hard truth.
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[Edit 1 times, last edit by mikipiki at Jun 17, 2017 10:46:28 AM]
[Jun 17, 2017 10:45:14 AM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
LJAmethyst

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Re: banned and I think it's a final goodbye Reply to this Post
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the love of money


...is the root of all evil.

And no, it's not like your example at all. It's more like if you were caught stealing at your job you'd be fired from your job, all your job-related perks were taken away, and if they ever found you sitting at your desk again they would have security escort you back out. Comparing bannination to life imprisonment is pretty ridiculous on the face of it.
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Retired as of August 2015.
2 Timothy 4:7
[Jun 17, 2017 12:21:07 PM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message    http://www.newadvent.org/bible/jon001.htm [Link]  Go to top 
Lolcaatz

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Re: banned and I think it's a final goodbye Reply to this Post
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I don't believe you're right there
[Jun 17, 2017 12:34:01 PM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
budclare2

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Re: banned and I think it's a final goodbye Reply to this Post
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Comparing bannination to life imprisonment is pretty ridiculous on the face of it.

Just on the face of it?
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Budclare on Meridian

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[Jun 17, 2017 12:46:26 PM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
Lolcaatz

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Re: banned and I think it's a final goodbye Reply to this Post
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"Comparing bannination to life imprisonment is pretty ridiculous on the face of it."

It's ridiculous and it's what it is really

Being banned from my crew is different than being banned from the game

So being fired from a Job is different than being banned from ever trying to find another

I agree, but your gist is slightly off imo
[Jun 17, 2017 1:04:43 PM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
Altich

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Re: banned and I think it's a final goodbye Reply to this Post
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I believe that the only offenses that must always be perma banned are use of cheating programs and selling doubloons with real money.

For other things, I think there should be several warnings before a perma ban.

Especially for stealing poes, the offender has most responsibility, but there is also big responsibility at the person who trusted him. So, although a bannable offense, I don't think a perma ban should be handed so easily for such cases.

Now, I'm not sure how honest the OP is, from his post it seems he scammed his crew for poes. Maybe he has done the same several times and he really deserves a perma ban? I don't know.

But puzzle pirates must go with the tide and reconstruct the banning system. Perma bans shouldn't be handled easily, they should be used only in cases when the offender severely harms the game, (cheating programs, selling doubloons for $). For everything else, you should give the person several chances to reform.

Please take a look at League of Legends. There is a reason they are one of the most popular online game. For the banning system, they focus on reforming the players rather than handing perma bans like peanuts. Permabans are rare, and even then, they allow the player to make a new account.

Also, you can think of more ways to punish bad pirates, like 50% reduction on poe earnings or something. Please focus on reforming, and not just discarding bad pirates. I think this is better for everyone.
[Jun 17, 2017 4:31:21 PM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
majestrate

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Re: banned and I think it's a final goodbye Reply to this Post
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Right now yppedia states (bolding the applicable part to this thread):

yppedia wrote: 
Players may be permanently banned for stealing. Regardless of whether or not a thief is banned, a theft goes on his or her permanent record.

If memory serves, the only time a player permanently banned on the first infraction is when the theft is severe (going through and cleaning out a significant amount of stock/eights from ships/shoppes/stalls the player doesn't own). It's entirely possible that when the game population exploded, this policy was changed due to the potential number of thefts that OMs had to deal with, but I can't remember whether or not that's true.
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[Edit 2 times, last edit by majestrate at Jun 18, 2017 12:54:50 AM]
[Jun 18, 2017 12:54:07 AM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message    first_majestrate    majestrait [Link]  Go to top 
Lolcaatz

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Re: banned and I think it's a final goodbye Reply to this Post
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Yes, I didn't mention the premise for why I took the stock/money from the holds when I appealed.

Would that of changed the effect of the appeal?
[Jun 18, 2017 1:21:48 AM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
Lolcaatz

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Re: banned and I think it's a final goodbye Reply to this Post
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Anyway, I think I stole a lot, I believe my intentions were to pay back. It happened so long ago it's hard to be definitive of what I was thinking.

Thanks for thinking about it at least.

Yes, I agree another chance to re-earn your ability to join the game, would be a sub-par addition.
[Jun 18, 2017 1:33:27 AM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
majestrate

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Re: banned and I think it's a final goodbye Reply to this Post
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Yes, I didn't mention the premise for why I took the stock/money from the holds when I appealed.

Would that of changed the effect of the appeal?

I'm not involved in the ban pleading process, but logic suggests that the reason for the theft would make no difference.

Good luck with your future gaming, hopefully you've learned a lesson from this experience!
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We can't rely on majestrate he yells at people


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[Jun 18, 2017 3:36:45 AM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message    first_majestrate    majestrait [Link]  Go to top 
Lolcaatz

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Re: banned and I think it's a final goodbye Reply to this Post
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Okay, definately haha!
[Jun 18, 2017 4:59:49 AM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
Altich

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Re: banned and I think it's a final goodbye Reply to this Post
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No reason to delete the thread.

I believe the company won't go far if they continue to enforce harsh primitive punishment systems.

I can't really talk about this specific case because I don't know this pirate's banning record but if he was PERMANENTLY ip banned for a single theft no matter how big, I think he (and anyone in his shoes) deserve more chances. Focus on reforming and NOT in just deleting people.
[Jun 18, 2017 8:52:58 AM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
majestrate

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Re: banned and I think it's a final goodbye Reply to this Post
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Disagree, some acts of theft do not deserve any leniency. If a player were to wipe out as much stock/eights (via selling/transfer/deletion) as possible for a crew, then no leniency should be granted.
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We can't rely on majestrate he yells at people


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[Jun 18, 2017 12:25:25 PM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message    first_majestrate    majestrait [Link]  Go to top 
Altich

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Re: banned and I think it's a final goodbye Reply to this Post
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Disagree, some acts of theft do not deserve any leniency. If a player were to wipe out as much stock/eights (via selling/transfer/deletion) as possible for a crew, then no leniency should be granted.

Puzzle pirates is trying to make a new start, and I don't want them to repeat the mistakes of the past. And although I can't be sure that their banning system is really a mistake, I hope that at least they will take a good look into it, and reconstruct it if necessary. Especially at the new ocean where PVP will be the core gameplay, if the banning system doesn't focus on REFORMING the players, then I predict that half of the active players will be perma banned in the first year or so for things like theft, sabotage etc. not to mention toxicity.

And why isn't the captain or hearty at fault for trusting a person not worthy of trust? Shouldn't they be more careful with their choices?
[Jun 18, 2017 12:59:04 PM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
Shinito

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Re: banned and I think it's a final goodbye Reply to this Post
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Disagree, some acts of theft do not deserve any leniency. If a player were to wipe out as much stock/eights (via selling/transfer/deletion) as possible for a crew, then no leniency should be granted.

 
Okay, definately haha!

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Thorkill on Malachite 2.0 Obsidian
[Jun 18, 2017 1:00:36 PM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
majestrate

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Re: banned and I think it's a final goodbye Reply to this Post
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And why isn't the captain or hearty at fault for trusting a person not worthy of trust? Shouldn't they be more careful with their choices?

And what if it were someone you had known for a number of months or a year+? What if it were someone that had shown you could trust them? The only way to truly stay safe is to trust no one, but that does little good in a game that requires social interaction.
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We can't rely on majestrate he yells at people


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[Jun 18, 2017 1:44:15 PM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message    first_majestrate    majestrait [Link]  Go to top 
wrs1864b

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Re: banned and I think it's a final goodbye Reply to this Post
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And why isn't the captain or hearty at fault for trusting a person not worthy of trust? Shouldn't they be more careful with their choices?

Wow. That is classic victim blaming. There are a lot of really good reasons why victim blaming is a horribly bad thing to do. Read the link if it isn't obvious to you.

As far as GH's banning system, I really can't say if it is good or bad because we almost always only get the side of story from the banned players and not from GH/OOO. The few times that GH has wandered into such discussions, forum readers almost always learn that the poor banned player had *MANY* warnings/temp bans/chances to reform and in the rare case that the final act was pretty minor, it is just the straw the broke the camel's back. Usually, however, the final act is much worse than what the player described.

Based on the cases where I have read both sides, I tend to think that the GH/OOO banning system is way too nice and people should be banned quicker and harsher. But then, GH/OOO only wander into the story when things are particularly bad.
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Algol can not assert the truth of all statements in this post and still be consistent.
[Jun 18, 2017 2:07:11 PM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
xelto

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Re: banned and I think it's a final goodbye Reply to this Post
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As far as GH's banning system, I really can't say if it is good or bad because we almost always only get the side of story from the banned players and not from GH/OOO. The few times that GH has wandered into such discussions, forum readers almost always learn that the poor banned player had *MANY* warnings/temp bans/chances to reform and in the rare case that the final act was pretty minor, it is just the straw the broke the camel's back. Usually, however, the final act is much worse than what the player described.

Based on the cases where I have read both sides, I tend to think that the GH/OOO banning system is way too nice and people should be banned quicker and harsher. But then, GH/OOO only wander into the story when things are particularly bad.

Ever so much so.

/e misses Cephalopwning.
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Gurndigarn on Emerald Ocean
"Oh, come on. You jobbed onto a ship called the Cursed Isle Raider and you expected *refined*?"
[Jun 18, 2017 2:36:59 PM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
Altich

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Re: banned and I think it's a final goodbye Reply to this Post
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And why isn't the captain or hearty at fault for trusting a person not worthy of trust? Shouldn't they be more careful with their choices?

Wow. That is classic victim blaming. There are a lot of really good reasons why victim blaming is a horribly bad thing to do. Read the link if it isn't obvious to you.


I personally wouldn't suggest to an officer to put all his poes in his unlocked ship. If he does, and someone steals them, yes, he is at fault along with the offender. Not sure what this victim blaming is.

Now, about the current banning system, I don't know if it's good or bad, I hope it is as you say and there are given many chances for reforming. I'm just expressing my general opinion on the matter.

I'm especially afraid of the new ocean, because the pvp will create many motives for stealing and otherwise acting dishonestly. I'd prefer finding ways to prevent these or remove motives rather than starting permabanning people.
[Jun 18, 2017 2:45:20 PM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
Shinito

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Re: banned and I think it's a final goodbye Reply to this Post
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Can we just get EVE Online rules along with 2-strike permabans? Than everyone will be happy.
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Thorkill on Malachite 2.0 Obsidian
[Jun 18, 2017 3:44:33 PM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
Lolcaatz

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Re: banned and I think it's a final goodbye Reply to this Post
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It would be great if an Ocean Master could post my History on here, so I can clarify my points.

Regardless I feel as though I would like to move on from this game, but some are willing to continue the discussion.
[Jun 18, 2017 6:24:18 PM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
Solowing

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Re: banned and I think it's a final goodbye Reply to this Post
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It would be great if an Ocean Master could post my History on here, so I can clarify my points.

Regardless I feel as though I would like to move on from this game, but some are willing to continue the discussion.


Won't happen, they don't (won't?) post your ban history or the related evidence on here.
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Solowing
Still suck at poker.
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[Jun 19, 2017 4:00:31 AM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
Altich

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Re: banned and I think it's a final goodbye Reply to this Post
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It would be great if an Ocean Master could post my History on here, so I can clarify my points.

Regardless I feel as though I would like to move on from this game, but some are willing to continue the discussion.


We are not discussing about you, but generally about the banning system. If you want to move on from this game then good luck on your future gaming experience :)
[Jun 19, 2017 4:43:50 AM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
EmpressTamar

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Re: banned and I think it's a final goodbye Reply to this Post
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And why isn't the captain or hearty at fault for trusting a person not worthy of trust? Shouldn't they be more careful with their choices?

Wow. That is classic victim blaming. There are a lot of really good reasons why victim blaming is a horribly bad thing to do. Read the link if it isn't obvious to you.


I personally wouldn't suggest to an officer to put all his poes in his unlocked ship. If he does, and someone steals them, yes, he is at fault along with the offender. Not sure what this victim blaming is.

Now, about the current banning system, I don't know if it's good or bad, I hope it is as you say and there are given many chances for reforming. I'm just expressing my general opinion on the matter.

I'm especially afraid of the new ocean, because the pvp will create many motives for stealing and otherwise acting dishonestly. I'd prefer finding ways to prevent these or remove motives rather than starting permabanning people.

I don't think leaving your house unlocked is justification for having all your valuables stolen. It might not be the brightest idea, but that doesn't mean the police will allow the thieves to get away with no consequences, assuming there's proof of the crime. I agree it's completely victim blaming and "but we're pirates" is not a valid excuse.
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Empresstamar of Emerald.
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[Jun 19, 2017 7:35:40 AM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
Altich

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Re: banned and I think it's a final goodbye Reply to this Post
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I don't think leaving your house unlocked is justification for having all your valuables stolen. It might not be the brightest idea, but that doesn't mean the police will allow the thieves to get away with no consequences, assuming there's proof of the crime. I agree it's completely victim blaming and "but we're pirates" is not a valid excuse.

Ah, maybe you didn't read my posts completely.
[Jun 19, 2017 8:12:39 AM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
Lolcaatz

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Re: banned and I think it's a final goodbye Reply to this Post
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I find this entertaining, sorry. haha

I might just spend the rest of my ypp career on the forums
[Jun 19, 2017 10:22:29 AM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
SirCarl67

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Re: banned and I think it's a final goodbye Reply to this Post
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As others have said we have only heard one side of the story and on the occasions that GH / OOO have spoken about banned players I have found them rather lenient.

Many years ago I was SO in a large crew. We had a crew member who after a couple of months in the crew was made FO. The next day we found almost every unlocked ship in the fleet had been had all its hold sold dock side and the poe stolen.

On petitioning the OM we were asked to list all the ships, the island they were at and the amount stolen. It took me and another SO several hours to check every unlocked ship (there were several hundred) and record what was stolen (a lot were empty but there was stuff taken from about 100 ships). Over the next few days the OMs were kind enough to return the majority of the poe stolen onto each ship and I am sure that also took a lot of time.

I did not enjoy that few hours and I am sure the OMs would rather spend time doing fun things like running competitions than dealing with theft.

Stealing in game money steels peoples real life time to deal with it. SOoe of that poe is likely to be bough with real money (via doubloons) so the effects of the theft are outside the game, you having just stolen virtual money you have stolen real money and real time.

Using the real world analogy you might not get a jail sentence for a first offence of theft but you would get a criminal record making it much harder to get a job, you might have to do hours of community service or get a fine of several hundred dollars. Having one less computer game you are able to play is minor compared to that.
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Apollo tells ye "If you're ok for me to do one [bake-off], I'll go with that."
[Jun 20, 2017 5:13:50 PM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
Lolcaatz

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Re: banned and I think it's a final goodbye Reply to this Post
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that sucks, sorry you had to go through that, I hope my actions didn't have that bad of a consequence

eye-opening
[Jun 20, 2017 7:56:47 PM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
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