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Hillsmen

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Re: How's the new BK doing?

 
 
The whole SMA argument is really getting old, just have to say that.


And your argument of "umgz no one has any poe! We should all give up and go play Runescape!" is getting old aswell.

Jus' Sayin'


I am just making the point that it isn't exactly a SMA, because I think the majority of people in the supposed "SMA" don't like each other. That is why we left AoD(except for a few flags). If people want to keep using the SMA argument I think it is easier just to call it a Super Mega Hate of one flag because I think that is what it obviously is. RM has a war dec on PM and SC, of course we aren't going to job for them. They have a war dec against the leaders of the AoD alliance too I believe, to lazy to log on and check. People are acting like there is a bunch of flags that get together in some basement and have meetings about how to job against RM. I think it is fairly obvious why they don't get jobbers from AoD, the IC alliance, and the others. When you have a war dec against the leaders of the alliances, that flag and the ones following it obviously aren't going to job for you. You may have a blockade that is AoD v RM alliance, and that leaves a large amount of neutral jobbers out there. Well when you have a war dec against their flag they obviously aren't going to job for you.

Complaining about war decs is completely pointless, so I am not doing that, but I think some people over look the common sense aspect and think that wow why aren't all of these neutral jobbers jobbing evenly for both sides? Well they aren't going to job for the flag that they can't even port at their islands. So that is how I think about the SMA argument.
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Captainrich
[May 6, 2011 5:03:22 PM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
LunEnvoy

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Re: How's the new BK doing?

@Tik- Rep ++
@Rich- Rep++

(Anti-Footnote- The following is a rant that starts off with a response to floody, but then drifts to other issues/points brought up in this thread or because of this thread)

@Floody-
 
I'm sure. Although you probably misheard it many of those times--easy to do, happens to me when I've learned something wrong. It's always worth looking up phrases you don't understand before rushing to "correct" them into something that <1% of the population has ever encountered. Especially an extremely common phrase that's over 400 years old.

I suppose you can continue to think it was a personal dig on Tik all you want, even though it was nothing more than me paraphrasing and giving Tik the credit I felt she still deserved for the original statement (in the context of this discussion). You can continue to rag on the manner in which people native to my region speak, if you must, just know the 'you must speak like world' is no less opinion-pressing than 'i will speak like i know'.
If you understand me, you know; if you dont, one tends to dislike me. Im like sandpaper, you just gotta use the right side. This 'lune you agressive dumb troll' is as old as the 'RM is evil' and the 'go you guys! woo IslandSittersUnited!". In fact, if you look at the manner in which people respond to my posts, you'll see an odd thing. That thing is that responses to my posts very often nearly completely exemplify some flawed aspect of the mental/characteristics of individuals that lies at the real root of Viridians problem. Opinions are subjective. And OOO has very nicely allowed for a complex political system that allows for opinions to have say over the game itself. This abstract concept clashes with the concrete aspect of PUZZLE Pirates. And these clashes make for (in my opinion) some of the most beautiful things about YPP. Its simply intriguing how time again its proven how easy it is for everyone to technically be right, yet through their own narrowed bias be detrimental to the overall picture. This is everyone. Starting to see how Im the epitome of Viridian yet?
On a related note, the problem seems to be the vast difference of playing style/mentality, aye? And so we have people all preaching their different views. If its supposed to be about working together, let me ask a simple question:
Those who have spoken to me in-game on friendly or at least non-hostile terms, can you say that I am truly the constant badgerer and 'all up in your business when I know nothing about it' guy ou see here? Didnt think so.
Whats this mean? Practice what you preach essentially. Yes, my character is strictly opposed to Roseh, and by extension RM. Yes my character has pissed off numerous people (as does my personality, just remember not to take it personal and its all good, no harm no foul, none intended). But its just that: a character. Why then is there such a hatred of me? We're all working together here aye?
See the two sides to the coin yet?

PS - If you think Im just spoutin bullshit, but can actually see some sort of point, you might find a decent amount of proof that Im more than a forum troll by talking to someone like Avi. Though you'll have to dig, she doesnt quite know the roll shes played so far, but would remember certain things upon prompting ;)
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LoLune

I'm still just the guard dog. I bite. They shoot.
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[Edit 2 times, last edit by LunEnvoy at May 6, 2011 6:54:50 PM]
[May 6, 2011 6:50:35 PM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
anchovygirl

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Re: How's the new BK doing?

Wait, since when did alliance webs have leaders? See, this is usually the downfall of alliance webs. For some reason, you guys decide to elect unofficial leaders. Yes, okay, there are some flags that have more political and blockade experience than others. But what usually happens is that the supposed leaders of the alliances end up carrying their whole alliance web which benefits no one. The AoD saw what happened when their leaders upped and left their alliance, they were pretty much left on the pavement, forced to defend for themselves and because they relied on their leaders to bail them out before, they were pretty much screwed because they didn't learn anything. This easily leads into the whole lack of new talent on the blockade scene argument that gets thrown around on occassion.

Rich, if RM has a war dec up against certain flags, then they're not neutral jobbers since as you said, they're not going to job for a flag that's war deccing them. But even if RM take the war dec down say, against PM and SC, what's the likelihood of them jobbing for RM if RM blockade whoever owns an island in that other ring? I would say very low.

I forgot where Dalnoth posted this, but he said somewhere that whilst helping BoD against RM, a side he's helped on a number of occassions, he was told that he should be hugging RM's crotch with his mouth. That's just one guy getting that sort of hostility. Clashes are healthy and all, but there's a huge difference between game clashes and personal clashes. Healthy game clashes are ones like between VG and SMA at the time back in 2009. After blockades, good game was said, hands were shaken and there were no hard feelings. But when you get told to get on your knees and open your mouth or whatever filth that these people come up with, it's not good and unfortunately, I've seen far too many people getting this kind of treatment just because of which side they chose to help.
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Anchovia
[May 6, 2011 7:27:59 PM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
fifasmells

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Re: How's the new BK doing?

Ok then,I give props to your post rose. So lets do it like this (still five islands) But how about scuttling em so flags can go aganist a BK that way they wont get the {Walk to go and collect your $200} kind of deal. They will have to fight a bk (possibly other flags) And let em make a thread about how Barnabas out jobbed em 5 frigs 3 brigs and 8 longships without paying.

Can we see this happening.Rose.
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What A R.......R....Real bad joke. BTW Rose already paid her chocodebt

Now on Facebook!
[May 6, 2011 7:28:32 PM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
MimiLinda

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Re: How's the new BK doing?

I don't think so Fifa. RM got more royals than just me, thats a decision the flag as whole would have to make, its not one I can make on my own but I highly doubt it.

And the scuttle option was already discussed we are still trying to decide wether we do events or scuttle them, but thats one of the options; personaly I rather see people fights for it since the idea is to incentivate people to blockade other flags.
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Roseh

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[May 6, 2011 7:39:46 PM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
Hillsmen

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Re: How's the new BK doing?

 
Rich, if RM has a war dec up against certain flags, then they're not neutral jobbers since as you said, they're not going to job for a flag that's war deccing them. But even if RM take the war dec down say, against PM and SC, what's the likelihood of them jobbing for RM if RM blockade whoever owns an island in that other ring? I would say very low.


Well when we didn't have a war dec against us I was jobbing for RM with a few others. Unless it was against our own alliance of course.
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Captainrich
[May 6, 2011 7:45:25 PM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
false_dmitri

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Re: How's the new BK doing?

LunEnvoy wrote: 
I suppose you can continue to think it was a personal dig on Tik all you want, even though it was nothing more than me paraphrasing and giving Tik the credit I felt she still deserved for the original statement (in the context of this discussion). You can continue to rag on the manner in which people native to my region speak, if you must, just know the 'you must speak like world' is no less opinion-pressing than 'i will speak like i know'.

I didn't think it was a personal dig, and I don't care whether you're trolling if you ask legitimate questions along the way.

Regarding your choice of words, when the world's biggest internet search stops producing after 52 results (don't ask me where Google got the 7k hits on the first page), there's a high chance someone could use your wording to pinpoint you personally, let alone someone from your "region". It isn't one of those 50/50 tossups like "could care less" vs. "couldn't care less". Why not learn from the correction for more important situations like a job interview?

It doesn't bother me if you keep using the corrupted version. I pointed it out for your benefit, not mine, and only because you'd emphasized that you didn't understand the standard usage.
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On hiatus. :(
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[Edit 1 times, last edit by false_dmitri at May 6, 2011 7:54:46 PM]
[May 6, 2011 7:54:03 PM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
Sav_

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Re: How's the new BK doing?

 
Wait, since when did alliance webs have leaders? See, this is usually the downfall of alliance webs. For some reason, you guys decide to elect unofficial leaders. Yes, okay, there are some flags that have more political and blockade experience than others. But what usually happens is that the supposed leaders of the alliances end up carrying their whole alliance web which benefits no one. The AoD saw what happened when their leaders upped and left their alliance, they were pretty much left on the pavement, forced to defend for themselves and because they relied on their leaders to bail them out before, they were pretty much screwed because they didn't learn anything. This easily leads into the whole lack of new talent on the blockade scene argument that gets thrown around on occassion.



Waitwaitwaitwaitwait

Since when were RM the "leaders" of the AoD. As long as I have been in the alliance, there have never been leaders. The alliance is and was a democracy.
[May 7, 2011 3:10:33 AM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
anchovygirl

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Re: How's the new BK doing?

Right, because all members of the AoD pulled in their weight when it came to blockade day and most of the blockade team for another flag's blockade was not made up of people from RM and BOOB.

I'll also pretend that time the AoD decided they needed someone to 'steer' them into the right direction didn't happen.

There's using your allies and then there's completely relying on them.
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Anchovia
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[Edit 1 times, last edit by anchovygirl at May 7, 2011 5:49:51 AM]
[May 7, 2011 5:48:32 AM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
boroboy1

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Re: Lets see what this New Bk is packn

Oh once again a PvP cade is blocked by a scuttle shield, nice one Saints of Glory



(It wasn't RiddleMakers dropping before we go down that argument)
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Seepnah
[May 7, 2011 6:31:12 AM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
Sav_

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Re: How's the new BK doing?

 
Right, because all members of the AoD pulled in their weight when it came to blockade day and most of the blockade team for another flag's blockade was not made up of people from RM and BOOB.

I'll also pretend that time the AoD decided they needed someone to 'steer' them into the right direction didn't happen.

There's using your allies and then there's completely relying on them.


Damn, Anch is so right. Basically, whenever someone in the AoD other than RM/ BooB got caded, we just sat there saying "mannn, i can't be bothered to defend, imma just ask RM and BooB to run the cade for us".

No but seriously, the only time I can think of your point being valid is the Olive cade where MS pulled out of R1 (for some reason, can't remember why) and Roseh won the cade for them in rounds 3-5. Oh yeah, and RM/ BooB cades of course.

At the end of the day, you will choose experience > inexperience if you want the best chance of winning. Tbh, the only time I see inexperienced cade staff getting used is in their own flags cade, and at that time, it was mainly RM and BooB cades.

Also, weren't we talking about alliance "leaders" not cade teams?
[May 7, 2011 6:51:10 AM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
LunEnvoy

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Re: How's the new BK doing?

 
It isn't one of those 50/50 tossups like "could care less" vs. "couldn't care less". Why not learn from the correction for more important situations like a job interview?


Actually, to say 'i could care less' is incorrect in the manner in which people use it. (It denotes the speaker doesnt care. Why then would you say its possible to care even less? haha :p)

How many people do you think are still going to say 'I could care less' regardless of the fact I just explained how its wrong? Plenty.
Likewise I will stick to my 'wrong' phrase, as understanding doesn't happen only at adoption of a notion.


Edit: @Sav- Usually when people are showing up again and again and more-so than some others to play on a team, theyre considered leaders.
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LoLune

I'm still just the guard dog. I bite. They shoot.
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[Edit 1 times, last edit by LunEnvoy at May 7, 2011 6:59:04 AM]
[May 7, 2011 6:54:47 AM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
anchovygirl

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Re: How's the new BK doing?

Sav wrote: 
Damn, Anch is so right. Basically, whenever someone in the AoD other than RM/ BooB got caded, we just sat there saying "mannn, i can't be bothered to defend, imma just ask RM and BooB to run the cade for us".
Read my post again, I never said that the AoD left it to RM and BOOB to defend for them but that most of the blockade staff was made up of them.

Like I said, there's using your allies and then there's relying on them. Sure people like to use experienced people to help them out, but is it really going to help when you don't even train people alongside them? No.

Yeah we were talking about leaders and I said that the former 'leaders' of the AoD carried most of the weight.
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Anchovia
[May 7, 2011 7:00:22 AM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
LunEnvoy

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Re: How's the new BK doing?

Okay, theoretical situation for yeh Sav. Lets say way back when RM/BooB was in the AoD...
If PM/Antheas or any other mix of 2 flags had up and left the AoD all of a sudden, do you really think there would have been even REMOTELY as close of a hubbub in VP about it as there was about the fact RM/BooB hopped off the groovy train? Nah
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LoLune

I'm still just the guard dog. I bite. They shoot.
[May 7, 2011 7:04:55 AM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
Sav_

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Re: How's the new BK doing?

 
Like I said, there's using your allies and then there's relying on them. Sure people like to use experienced people to help them out, but is it really going to help when you don't even train people alongside them? No.


I believe there was training. And there was other cade staff with some/ little experience after RM/ BooB left, but you have to remember another 3 flags left the AoD about a month after RM and BooB, and some people retiring. Sorry, but I don't think anyone was able to predict that.


Lune wrote: 
Okay, theoretical situation for yeh Sav. Lets say way back when RM/BooB was in the AoD...
If PM/Antheas or any other mix of 2 flags had up and left the AoD all of a sudden, do you really think there would have been even REMOTELY as close of a hubbub in VP about it as there was about the fact RM/BooB hopped off the groovy train? Nah


Sorry, but I don't see how your point is relevant to what I've said in my last 2 posts. The alliance with the most islands is pretty much always the alliance that is most disliked by people not in that alliance. E.g when the AoD was the SMA, Nayfin had an avatar of someone pissing on the letters AoD (good avatar, I was sad he removed it), now (if I remember correctly) he is a royal in UWS.
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[Edit 1 times, last edit by Sav_ at May 7, 2011 7:55:42 AM]
[May 7, 2011 7:36:35 AM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
LunEnvoy

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Re: How's the new BK doing?

 
Lune wrote: 
Okay, theoretical situation for yeh Sav. Lets say way back when RM/BooB was in the AoD...
If PM/Antheas or any other mix of 2 flags had up and left the AoD all of a sudden, do you really think there would have been even REMOTELY as close of a hubbub in VP about it as there was about the fact RM/BooB hopped off the groovy train? Nah


Sorry, but I don't see how your point is relevant to what I've said in my last 2 posts. The alliance with the most islands is pretty much always the alliance that is most disliked by people not in that alliance. E.g when the AoD was the SMA, Nayfin had an avatar of someone pissing on the letters AoD (good avatar, I was sad he removed it), now (if I remember correctly) he is a royal in UWS.


Your 'last two posts' are about whether or not RM/BooB were leaders of the AoD. Not about Nathanshawn pissing on em. Stay with the program ;)

And its really shouldn't be so much a matter of like/dislike, which is what is trying to be said here by multiple people, and has been said for a while.

Personally, a large percentage of my acquaintances and more favored people come/came from SC even though I feel that alot of the opinions coming from that way (and ICs way while I was in IC) are/(were) naiive. But bloods blood.

Honestly Id much rather be with RM if simply because they make more sense (spin is just a part of the game.). However, that would be boring, wouldnt it?


Now back on subject: After RM/BooB left the AoD, the two of them together still did more than the entirety of the AoD combined could manage. And still do. We can dispute the trivial facts all day, but the fact of the matter is that RM didnt become 'the alliance with all the islands' because Jesus sneezed and flowers grew, or because the AoD held their hand and walked em through it.

Edit: shouldn't
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LoLune

I'm still just the guard dog. I bite. They shoot.
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[Edit 1 times, last edit by LunEnvoy at May 7, 2011 8:37:29 AM]
[May 7, 2011 8:34:05 AM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
Sav_

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Re: How's the new BK doing?

Clearly the letters E.g confuse you, but ok then.

You seem to think that I'm hating on RM, which is not the case. I am just pointing out that there aren't and never have been "leaders" in the AoD as far as I know.
[May 7, 2011 8:41:08 AM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
LunEnvoy

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Re: How's the new BK doing?

Sav wrote: 
Clearly the letters E.g confuse you, but ok then.

You seem to think that I'm hating on RM, which is not the case. I am just pointing out that there aren't and never have been "leaders" in the AoD as far as I know.


Sav wrote: 
The alliance with the most islands is pretty much always the alliance that is most disliked by people not in that alliance.


I'm replying to this. I don't think you're hating on RM. But since were here, guilty conscience?

Aslo, usage of E.g. allows one to post subject matter irrelevant to the topic? Well then Id take it that so does:
Lune wrote: 
Okay, theoretical situation for yeh Sav.


Maybe I was wrong, posing against yall isnt boring. You're like a merry-go-round, faster circles than Roseh even. Kudos, for what the talents worth.

Edit: You're getting hung up on the word 'leaders'. Think 'most prominent members of society' rather than 'mighty and powerful worshipped by the masses and here to deliver and lead us to glory oceanic royalty.'
Theyre not saying you worshipped and kissed RMs feet.
Just giggled and kissed their aces.
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LoLune

I'm still just the guard dog. I bite. They shoot.
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[Edit 1 times, last edit by LunEnvoy at May 7, 2011 9:06:31 AM]
[May 7, 2011 8:58:33 AM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
false_dmitri

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Re: How's the new BK doing?

LunEnvoy wrote: 
Actually, to say 'i could care less' is incorrect in the manner in which people use it. (It denotes the speaker doesnt care. Why then would you say its possible to care even less? haha :p)

It's incorrect literally. It can be said sarcastically or idiomatically. And it's in very wide use, like "irregardless". It's not going away. Your mangling of Shakespeare is very uncommon, so it sticks out, obfuscates your intended meaning, and makes you look especially ignorant when you hold it up as a correction.

I'm not here to play Language Cop, so go ahead and say whatever you want. :)
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On hiatus. :(
[May 7, 2011 10:08:17 AM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
LunEnvoy

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Re: How's the new BK doing?

The meaning remained the same, the obfuscation comes from ones personal interpretation/inference of what I said. The only one holding my paraphrasing as a correction between you and I is you, not I.

That said, the sub-conscience(or sub-conscious, once again colloquialisms) plays the bigger role in the basis of inference. The sub-conscience is founded on the manner(s), region(s), etc. that you have lived your life to the present moment. Your take on the two phrases is as much biased as mine is. While I do not deny the validity of the version you defend as proper, you are harping rather much on the subject of my version's 'inferiority' to the norm.
On that note, let's not speak of ignorance just yet, remember it's a term that likes to flit between objective and subjective.
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LoLune

I'm still just the guard dog. I bite. They shoot.
[May 7, 2011 12:32:33 PM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
EgoavilJ

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Re: How's the new BK doing?

 
Sorry, but I don't see how your point is relevant to what I've said in my last 2 posts. The alliance with the most islands is pretty much always the alliance that is most disliked by people not in that alliance. E.g when the AoD was the SMA, Nayfin had an avatar of someone pissing on the letters AoD (good avatar, I was sad he removed it), now (if I remember correctly) he is a royal in UWS.


I helped form AoD the first time when it was up against Vanguard, Sea Wrath and the RM/SC alliance. I stopped playing for a bit then started again in VVL which was part of the sort lived Establishment, and there we couldn't really blockade to win anywhere. SMA's are no fun to go up against so of course people are going to get pissed when they don't have a fair chance at blockading because they are going to be outjobbed/outpayed/outnavved.
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~Nayfin~
-Lord of United We Stand on Viridian Ocean.
-Prince of Adrenaline on Malachite Ocean.

 
Good luck on Mala, I heard they're all a bunch of ignorant potheads.


~I'm back!~
[May 7, 2011 7:47:19 PM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
MimiLinda

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Re: How's the new BK doing?

[derail] By stopped playing you mean got banned for bilgebotting on Nathanshanw right? [/derail]
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Roseh

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[May 7, 2011 7:56:28 PM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
Cnuofesd

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Re: How's the new BK doing?

Nayfin wrote
 
We need to even up blockades.



There's a line. You can't expect mid cade when a ship sinks to go, "Okay, Marto, can you dive off points for a segment to keep it fair? We need to teach our JC's what reverve pay is."

There's a difference between treating sides equally, and trying to make sides equal. The Non-RM flags are looking for the second form, when the first one is what blockading should be about.
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Capablanca on Emerald
My posts are not my own opinion.
[May 8, 2011 4:19:46 PM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
LunEnvoy

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Re: How's the new BK doing?

Well said.
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LoLune

I'm still just the guard dog. I bite. They shoot.
[May 8, 2011 4:48:04 PM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
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