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slipster216



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Yo Ho Ho Instant Messanger mode we go.. Reply to this Post
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Here's an idea - once theres some type of housing, allow people to stay logged in with only a chat window and friends list. I find myself logging into the game a lot to see who's "around". Without all the position updates, etc, this would be pretty light on the bandwidth..

Oh yeah, and full screen would rock ;)
[Nov 7, 2002 10:26:20 AM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
Cleaver
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Aye aye Slipster. Yes, indeed, I like this idea -- so much so that it's been vaguely a part of the long-range plan for a while. There are various things we'd like to do to allow people to Yohoho! in components, as it were. A more obvious one that may or may not ever happen would be cellphone access to parts of the game, alerts etc.

As for full-screen, we actually have it disabled because of issues thrown up by Windoze. When we get a chance we'll tackle 'em and there'll be glorious full-screen action. Although for those of us with LCDs (not to mention an alt-tab fixation), we'll probably stick to the windowed version.

-- Cleaverrr
[Nov 7, 2002 12:13:08 PM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message    http://www.puzzlepirates.com/ [Link]  Go to top 
Meghaford



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Re: Yo Ho Ho Instant Messanger mode we go.. Reply to this Post
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Honestly I think I prefer the game running in a window... so I can check mail, surf the internet, etc. during a slow time or while waiting for someone or whatever.
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--Ursela, Captain of the Dastards
... and a few others ...
[Nov 7, 2002 10:23:53 PM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message    http://www.rjmlb.com [Link]  Go to top 
Bistronaut



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Re: Yes indeed. Reply to this Post
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Cleaver wrote: 
Aye aye Slipster. Yes, indeed, I like this idea -- so much so that it's been vaguely a part of the long-range plan for a while. There are various things we'd like to do to allow people to Yohoho! in components, as it were. A more obvious one that may or may not ever happen would be cellphone access to parts of the game, alerts etc.


Extended chat capabilities seem to be at the top of everyone's list, and chat systems can get complicated really quick. Has anyone considered using Jabber? The devs could set up a machine at chat.puzzlepirates.com and write a conduit from the existing chat system to Jabber. You could talk to any pirates logged on in-game or through jabber at piratename@chat.puzzlepirates.com. There are already clients out the yin-yang available for all platforms (including serveral java ones). Showing on-line status is optional in Jabber, and you could have it off by default for new users. Alerts could be handled by Jabber, which already has conduits for sending cell phone text messages and e-mail. Really, once the devs made the game-to-jabber conduit, they could implement new features as quick as "./configure; make; make install".

Heck, I think the only problem might be that it could be too powerful.
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Bredbeard - Sailmaster of Easily Distracted
Member of Silver Dawn
[Dec 8, 2003 2:23:14 AM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
cmdrzoom

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Re: Yo Ho Ho Instant Messanger mode we go.. Reply to this Post
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Using the game/server as a chat engine without the ability or the intention to puzzle defeats its purpose, IMO. I don't want to see a lot of idle chatter from people I never actually see logged into the game.

(This is not necessarily a rational position; more of a gut reaction. "If you just want to chat, why don't you go to IRC?")
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Starhawk of Mad Mutineers, Azure
Catalina of Twilight's Sabre, Cobalt
[Dec 8, 2003 3:48:54 AM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
atteSmythe

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Re: Yo Ho Ho Instant Messanger mode we go.. Reply to this Post
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Personally, I like to be available to me crew, even sometimes when I'm at work. Leaving a game window open looks bad, but just about everyone here uses instant messangers...

atteSmythe,
who also likes posting to the forums from work.
----------------------------------------
 
Attesmythe receives loot: [Gauntlets of Social Responsibility]
Attesmythe receives loot: [Ring of Mandatory Selflessness]

[Dec 8, 2003 4:01:00 AM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message    http://attesmythe.com [Link]  Go to top 
homullus

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Re: Yo Ho Ho Instant Messanger mode we go.. Reply to this Post
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I wouldn't mind being able to chat with people in the game via the game, as long as "away" messages could be set quickly, since I don't need windows popping up and taskbars flashing when I'm trying to talk to somebody in person at work.

In terms of productivity, I'd rather such an implementation waited until after The Stupid Dissertation is done.
[Dec 8, 2003 4:14:49 AM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message    homullus [Link]  Go to top 
cmdrzoom

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Re: Yo Ho Ho Instant Messanger mode we go.. Reply to this Post
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Aye, and I'm posting from work too. (Shh. :)

I guess my question would be, how available are you if you're only on via a chat interface? You can't check prices, you can't whisk pirates to ye, you can't look at a new outfit, and you certainly can't take a boat out.

I worry about YPP's focus being diluted. I worry about a vast invisible membership that never actually logs in, just clutters up crew chat. I feel that you should either play the game, or don't.
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Starhawk of Mad Mutineers, Azure
Catalina of Twilight's Sabre, Cobalt
[Dec 8, 2003 4:16:39 AM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
atteSmythe

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Re: Yo Ho Ho Instant Messanger mode we go.. Reply to this Post
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I see it as an aid for the social puzzle only. If I need to meet with my Monarch, who's 13 hours ahead of me, we pretty much have to do it when one of us is at work. Or if the crew is pushing for a fund drive, and want to know what our standing is, or I'd like to know how a prospective officer's training went, or any of a myriad of reasons.

I suppose the short answer is: There are many times when I log in and don't play a single puzzle.

As always, though, please finish the important things first. If I really really need to do any of the above, I can use the crew forum.

atteSmythe,
who's just looking for an excuse to open up the puzzle pirates at work
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Attesmythe receives loot: [Gauntlets of Social Responsibility]
Attesmythe receives loot: [Ring of Mandatory Selflessness]

[Dec 8, 2003 4:32:15 AM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message    http://attesmythe.com [Link]  Go to top 
joedigriz

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Re: Yo Ho Ho Instant Messanger mode we go.. Reply to this Post
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cmdrzoom wrote: 
I guess my question would be, how available are you if you're only on via a chat interface? You can't check prices, you can't whisk pirates to ye, you can't look at a new outfit, and you certainly can't take a boat out.

There are several aspects that you definitely shouldn't need the entire client running to participate in. A (smallish) sample:

1) Discussions about flag/crew issues
2) Voting on topics, if implemented. (Wouldn't be surprised if Cleaver has that on his wish list.)
3) Answering questions or concerns from crewmembers
4) Preparations for large events, such as parties or blockades

(And yes, I'm posting from work as well...)

As this game, by its very nature, is more "socially-oriented" than others, a "chat+" interface would fit in quite well.

EDIT:
atteSmythe wrote: 
I suppose the short answer is: There are many times when I log in and don't play a single puzzle.

As always, though, please finish the important things first. If I really really need to do any of the above, I can use the crew forum.

Yea. What he said. :)
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Garbuck - Red Mantis Scapegoat and Pretty Pretty Princess
[Dec 8, 2003 4:48:25 AM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message    jal_95    joedigriz [Link]  Go to top 
Amberyl

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Re: Yo Ho Ho Instant Messanger mode we go.. Reply to this Post
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I'm with atteSmythe on this one.

I don't want to be logging into the game from work, especially given the screen real estate that the graphics take up. I am, however, happy to conduct some amount of crew business when I have spare moments, so the relevant folks know how to contact me via AIM. But it means that I can't access in-game data -- bank account amounts, people's ranks and titles, ship locations, etc. So a chat and data-only client would be very handy for me.
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Amberyl, SO, Cult of the Red Mantis, Looterati
Reading the forums a lot is like camping clue. --homullus
[Dec 8, 2003 4:50:13 AM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message    http://www.black-knight.org/pp/    CyberLWL [Link]  Go to top 
Telastyn



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Re: Yo Ho Ho Instant Messanger mode we go.. Reply to this Post
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Last I heard an email system [or rather a message system for leaving pirates messages when they're not online] is on the List, and I think might solve more problems than this would without creating more problems, like having to check if your crew is really online or just ypp-lite.
[Dec 8, 2003 4:54:14 AM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
Lothy



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Re: Yo Ho Ho Instant Messanger mode we go.. Reply to this Post
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Yeah, I'm another vote for the "just use some other IM program" philosophy.

I think it's a good idea to be able to contact crewmates, and the aforementioned in-game "e-mail" system might work well for that. I know Tribes 2 had something similar to that way back when I tried that game out, and it worked ok if I recall. It just seems like a lot of extra hassle and development on the part of the Ringers to build a fully functional IM client into Y!PP that can be accessed while not actually logged in...

Do what other crews have done... set up an alternative form of communication. My crew has a message board and each other's AIM addresses (for those of us who are on IM a lot at work)...

It seems like with such a daunting and massive List in front of our favorite devs, to put something else on it that can be accomplished already without the use of the Y!PP client is just adding to the mess! :)
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Lothy[size=9], Senior Officer of the Free Radicals
Sailing under the Flag Plundered Hearts
[Dec 8, 2003 5:19:25 AM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
atteSmythe

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Re: Yo Ho Ho Instant Messanger mode we go.. Reply to this Post
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See, but IM programs = teh suck, while Y!PP = teh nifty.

atteSmythe,
teh letter transopser
----------------------------------------
 
Attesmythe receives loot: [Gauntlets of Social Responsibility]
Attesmythe receives loot: [Ring of Mandatory Selflessness]

[Dec 8, 2003 5:32:33 AM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message    http://attesmythe.com [Link]  Go to top 
joedigriz

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Re: Yo Ho Ho Instant Messanger mode we go.. Reply to this Post
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Lothy wrote: 
I think it's a good idea to be able to contact crewmates, and the aforementioned in-game "e-mail" system might work well for that.


Email is great if you don't need to have a realtime discussion. Otherwise, it tends to have lots of problems. And this is coming from someone who was never all that fond of chatting, whether it be IM, IRC, "talk", or telephone. (Yes, I'm serious - up until just 2 or 3 years ago, I steadfastly refused to even get an AIM account. Email was "more that good enough".)

 
Do what other crews have done... set up an alternative form of communication. My crew has a message board and each other's AIM addresses (for those of us who are on IM a lot at work)...

This assumes 2 things:

1) Everyone is on AIM (or Yahoo, or MSN, or any IM, for that matter)
2) Everyone wants to give out their IM address. (Just because people don't mind chatting in a game, doesn't mean that they'd feel comfortable with it out of game.)

Cleaver's already stated he'd love to have this (or, at least, something like it) at some point. And none of us are asking that it be put in before Adventure Islands, Flag Wars, ship logs, houses, or any of the billion other more important things on The List. But there's nothing wrong with talking about it. ;)
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Garbuck - Red Mantis Scapegoat and Pretty Pretty Princess
[Dec 8, 2003 5:50:15 AM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message    jal_95    joedigriz [Link]  Go to top 
Lothy



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Re: Yo Ho Ho Instant Messanger mode we go.. Reply to this Post
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Oh I'm not slamming anyone for chatting it up... I was just questioning it's necessity in the grand scheme of things. :) Seems to me one of those things that you'd look to add when all else is done and you're looking for a colorful new feature.

That's cool if Cleaver and the gang are going to put it in there, so how about you take my suggestions as a means of dealing "in the meantime" until they do?

 
1) Everyone is on AIM (or Yahoo, or MSN, or any IM, for that matter)
2) Everyone wants to give out their IM address. (Just because people don't mind chatting in a game, doesn't mean that they'd feel comfortable with it out of game.)


Well I think there's a program out there called Trillian that's like an AIM, MSN, Yahoo, etc. client all combined into one program. I don't personally use but I have a few friends who swear by it.

And what's wrong with the message board idea, aside from the fact that it takes a little set up time?

Come now...it wouldn't be a very fun message board if everyone always just agreed on everything! :) hehehe By all means, continue to debate... it's fun! :)

/me hopes he hasn't stirred up a hornet's nest...
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Lothy[size=9], Senior Officer of the Free Radicals
Sailing under the Flag Plundered Hearts
[Dec 8, 2003 5:57:28 AM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
spinn

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Re: Yo Ho Ho Instant Messanger mode we go.. Reply to this Post
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Yeah, I'd have quite a lot of reason to chat in-game without actually being in game. (On "why not just use IRC", well...ever had some reason you needed to move an IRC community? It's very difficult when there's an established location already.)

My only question would be how you'd do the interface for game people. Heh, maybe a room with an intercom where pirates can enter, and people in the chat-only version see the current room list.

Or, piratey conference rooms! You could go upstairs in the inn and rent a speakerphone.
----------------------------------------
And thus, the message is concluded.
[Dec 8, 2003 5:59:15 AM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message    http://www.spinnwebe.com/ [Link]  Go to top 
joedigriz

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Re: Yo Ho Ho Instant Messanger mode we go.. Reply to this Post
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Lothy wrote: 
Come now...it wouldn't be a very fun message board if everyone always just agreed on everything! :) hehehe By all means, continue to debate... it's fun! :)

/me hopes he hasn't stirred up a hornet's nest...

/em laughs.

Sorry if I came off too serious there. But I get the twitches everytime I hear the old "I don't see a need for this" thing. Mainly because most people I've seen use that phrase mentally apply the "and therefore, no one else should have a need for it either" attitude. (Observed behaviour in general, not anyone specific, mind you.)

And yes, I agree that there are interim solutions aplenty. Just none of them quite so, umm, seamless. ;)
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Garbuck - Red Mantis Scapegoat and Pretty Pretty Princess
[Dec 8, 2003 6:06:42 AM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message    jal_95    joedigriz [Link]  Go to top 
cmdrzoom

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Re: Yo Ho Ho Instant Messanger mode we go.. Reply to this Post
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For the third and final time, I reiterate my concern that this feature will lead to a division in the population between those who are "present" in the game, doing the puzzles, hanging out on the docks - in short, actually playing - and those who don't bother to log in because they're only interested in chatting with their mates or conducting crew/flag business.

There, I'm done.
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Starhawk of Mad Mutineers, Azure
Catalina of Twilight's Sabre, Cobalt
[Dec 8, 2003 6:10:03 AM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
54x

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I for one always get the feeling other people don't see me as 'playing the game' when I'm managing the store or on the docks. Thus I don't think it would have that much effect: it's just like someone hanging out in their store, or on the docks, or talking somewhere private about flag issues. There are already a large amount of people who log into the game and don't pillage, or trade for quite a few of their sessions.
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Diamondblade, Cartographer, Crimson Tide.
from Midnight.
Dear sir or madam can you read my book, it took me years to write, will you take a look?
[Dec 8, 2003 9:14:03 AM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message    http://www.mjwhitehead.com/    raasike54    secondlight5454    32987700 [Link]  Go to top 
spinn

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Re: Yo Ho Ho Instant Messanger mode we go.. Reply to this Post
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cmdrzoom wrote: 
For the third and final time, I reiterate my concern that this feature will lead to a division in the population between those who are "present" in the game, doing the puzzles, hanging out on the docks - in short, actually playing - and those who don't bother to log in because they're only interested in chatting with their mates or conducting crew/flag business.

Yeah, I don't see the division. If you're going to say "hanging out on the docks - in short, actually playing", you're already saying that doing nothing but chatting is playing.

And, come to think of it, your last sentence almost implies "conducting crew/flag business" isn't playing.
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And thus, the message is concluded.
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cmdrzoom

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spinn wrote: 

Yeah, I don't see the division. If you're going to say "hanging out on the docks - in short, actually playing", you're already saying that doing nothing but chatting is playing.


Someone hanging out on the docks has a presence in the game. They can be seen and interacted with by strangers as well as people they already know. (While bothersome at times, I happen to think this is good for the game in many ways.) And they can do other things - sword fight, go out on a ship, go to a shop, etc - if and when they like, without having to log out of their bare-bones chat client and back in. Sometimes even a speed bump can be a barrier, and the path of least resistance becomes habit.

 

And, come to think of it, your last sentence almost implies "conducting crew/flag business" isn't playing.


I confess I'm probably thinking of the worst case scenario here - most captains and monarchs are people who enjoy the social puzzle, and if they are able to play that one without logging all the way into the game, why should they bother? Already, there are many who admit they don't really go out pillaging anymore.

Alpha isn't going to become a ghost town any time soon, but what I dread is crews and even flags being led by invisible shades, people who haven't been seen except on a chat channel in months.

That answer your question?
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Starhawk of Mad Mutineers, Azure
Catalina of Twilight's Sabre, Cobalt
[Dec 8, 2003 3:16:00 PM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
Bistronaut



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Re: Yo Ho Ho Instant Messanger mode we go.. Reply to this Post
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So, to recap, possible cons:

  • ]Game gets clogged up with chat
  • ]Decreased productivity while we're at work
  • ]Features are low on "The List"
  • ]Is crew really online, or just on "YPP lite"
  • ]IM programs = teh suck
  • ]"flags being led by invisible shades"
    [/list:u:7ef50ce519]
    Possible pros:

    • ]Jabber server could do extarnal alerts (cell, e-mail)
    • ]Captains can make themselves more available to crew (social puzzle)
    • ]Jabber servers can queue offline messages (handling the in-game e-mail)
    • ]Some IM programs = teh nifty (IMHO)
    • ]Not everybody on AIM (Jabber would provide common network)
    • ]Don't have to disclose your external IM names
    • ]"flags being led by invisible shades"
      [/list:u:7ef50ce519]

      I really think that the increased presence, even when they're not "all the way" in-game, of captains and such would help out the social part of the game more than detract from it.

      And on the developer time front, Jabber would fill in a lot of spots on "The List" and be a lot easier to implement than each one individually.

      I think that PHPbb is practically a part of the game, and if the "forum puzzle" helps so much, why couldn't a "chat puzzle" be a boon as well?

    ----------------------------------------
    Bredbeard - Sailmaster of Easily Distracted
    Member of Silver Dawn
[Dec 8, 2003 10:45:44 PM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
spinn

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cmdrzoom wrote: 
That answer your question?

Sorta, except you're only speaking to your personal preference and not to game benefit, it seems like. These are things you wouldn't like to see other people using, but I still see the use in them.

Example: There are times I need to find people, but I don't want to go in game, because it's too potentially distracting in a busy day. So at the moment I default to sending mail or PMs, but if I had a way to get instant response without the worry of my weak will being drawn into some gun-loading, I would use it. And "get AIM or IRC" is not the answer, because these things will always be a subset of who's currently online in the game.

edit: well, not literally a subset. Still, if I had a sudden reason to talk to Thusnelda or Fronsac or Mnemosyne or someone else random who's not in my day-to-day, I generally wouldn't expect them to be on IRC or AIM (or even to have AIM, or even to know their AIM names if they did). Or even if these people had AIM and I knew their AIM names and they happened to be online, I probably still wouldn't bother them, because The Game is not Life, and I don't want to bug people if they're otherwise occupied. Being in game is the clearest flag for "you can talk to me about game issues" that I can think of.
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And thus, the message is concluded.
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atteSmythe

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spinn wrote: 
...because The Game is not Life...

I recognize all these words, but they don't make any sense together...

atteSmythe,
posting instead of working. Hooray!
----------------------------------------
 
Attesmythe receives loot: [Gauntlets of Social Responsibility]
Attesmythe receives loot: [Ring of Mandatory Selflessness]

[Dec 9, 2003 2:01:37 AM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message    http://attesmythe.com [Link]  Go to top 
Tee_Beard



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spinn wrote: 
...because The Game is not Life...


That's probably one reason why I'd want a version of Y!PP lite, or even a Jabber implementation of Y!PP (time to get another IM program, heh!). Especially if it means I can actually go out and still log on or leave messages (via text messaging or a simple mobile phone client).

I can count the number of people who have access to me off Y!PP with... well, there's a dozen of 'em, maybe less. And that's inconvenient, because I like my online life to be separate from my piratey life.

I don't want to have to talk to everyone I meet on PP via IM. Accepting IM friends means that I accept them into life outside of PP, and that's something I don't want. Even if it is Spinn, atteSmythe or anyone, really, who're people I enjoy talking to while PP. It's just the way I am.

There is this big gap between Thesis the pirate and whoever plays Thesis, and I want to keep that gap. Having an IM gateway would actually help that, a lot.

Though it's not that terribly urgent. I mean, get everything else done first, eh?
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Thesis
It’s kind of funny/sad how I still can find the thing that made me part of Y!PP canon.
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Milliardo



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i really like the idea. i have the luxury of from time to time logging in at work and talking with mates, answer any questions etc. etc. etc. But not all the time. I think the chat idea is great. with all the newbs that will be coming aboard it would be great for them to have a reference person that they can always "hit up for a quick answer" if they are uncertain of an aspect of the game. if you don't like the idea, then don't use it if it gets implemented. great ideas Bistronaut, thanks for coming up with a real idea instead of "fix this, I don't like that" need more mates like you.
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Captainjimmy

Captain of Easily Distracted

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[Edit 1 times, last edit by Milliardo at Dec 9, 2003 2:31:58 AM]
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54x

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Even if it is Spinn, atteSmythe or anyone, really, who're people I enjoy talking to while PP. It's just the way I am.


Hmmm. Some of us are just more private I guess. I know I have little problem with dealing with anyone on IM services that I know from elsewhere, as long as they understand that I can't be online 24/7 to talk to them. I'm the same person on PP as off it, really, just with less amusing jokes about well-known players.

Diamondblade, who isn't talking about AtteSmythe ;)
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Diamondblade, Cartographer, Crimson Tide.
from Midnight.
Dear sir or madam can you read my book, it took me years to write, will you take a look?
[Dec 9, 2003 2:59:47 AM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message    http://www.mjwhitehead.com/    raasike54    secondlight5454    32987700 [Link]  Go to top 
atteSmythe

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Joined: Jul 28, 2003
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Re: Yo Ho Ho Instant Messanger mode we go.. Reply to this Post
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My problem with IMs has little to do with who can contact me via them and more to do with "Hi, my name is Erica. Would you like to meet me some time?" And people that I don't even know adding me to their lists, though my permissions shouldn't allow it, and adding themselves to my list, even though I never requested it.

Given that IMs are supposed to be instant, ignoring it because of SPAM takes away all benefit of the tool. If I want to sort through SPAM, I'll use email.

atteSmythe,
who's a little uncomfortable seeing his name tossed about so often...
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Attesmythe receives loot: [Gauntlets of Social Responsibility]
Attesmythe receives loot: [Ring of Mandatory Selflessness]

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cmdrzoom

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Re: Yo Ho Ho Instant Messanger mode we go.. Reply to this Post
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spinn wrote: 

Sorta, except you're only speaking to your personal preference and not to game benefit, it seems like. These are things you wouldn't like to see other people using, but I still see the use in them.


I see the benefit to the user, in terms of convenience, etc; I also see the (potential) cost. Don't you think it's a benefit to the game to be able to see people on line, even if they're just lurking in a shop corner? Or to talk to someone you don't know once in a while? Or to actually go out pillaging with your mates now and then - seeing as you're a very hands-on captain, I imagine you do.

Do you really not see the problem in a flag being ruled by a council of disembodied heads? Or an officer saying to a new cabin person, "Aye, our captain's on chat most days, but I've never actually sailed with him"?

Heck, let's toss out Midnight's virtual world and remake PP as a set of chatrooms, with hyperlinks to the puzzles (which could still be cooperative). Get rid of the little pirate faces while you're at it and just go with names. That would cut overhead tremendously, not to mention saving Nemo a lot of work.
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Starhawk of Mad Mutineers, Azure
Catalina of Twilight's Sabre, Cobalt
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