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PhantomNuke

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So you just bought OOO... Reply to this Post
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It turned out that the revenue was dropping steadily, despite the almost clockwork spikes of income as the team released another money-grabbing scheme consisting of a few pixels and not much more. SEGA knew that soon the income wouldn't cover the developer costs, the office, the server. The team would have to be let go and the project shelved. They have some sense, and realise that the process could prove costly; just as importantly, the players are attached to the game and will not think highly of the company that ran it into the ground. They want to be far away when the smelly stuff hits the spinny thingy. They're amazed when you want to take it off their hands and sign it over at knock-down prices. They keep hold of SK though, that game's bringing in the dough like nobody's business.

So, now you own Y!PP, and the dev team currently in charge of it. Cleaver shifts uneasily at the end of a conference table. What's your first order of business?

Choose any two things you can change in the game or in the development process, or in the company. What do you do?


I know I'm not the only one entertaining this fantasy now and then, and my two immediate changes are:

1) Afternoon Bugsplat

First and foremost, one hour or time slot of one day of every week is chosen. Maybe even a Thursday morning so that a patch can be rolled out and if necessary a hotfix can be issued before the weekend. During this time, developers stop working on their pet features, and fix bugs. Just bugs, that's it. Adobe did it for CS6, and with the number of bugs present in the game currently, you can do it too.

2) Forum Hour.

A developer is chosen to be the community liaison. One day is chosen, and each week, that developer will spend 30 minutes browsing and replying on the forums, and the following 30 minutes in live chat with the denizens of Game Design. Should interest be too high, posting during the forum time will be restricted to GD regulars, and these will be the only people allowed to post in the chat (rules to be relaxed on quiet days, if such a thing should occur). The first meeting of the morning, the developer will gather progress reports or other input from the development team, and later in the day perform the "forum hour". Ideally, this will immediately precede the afternoon meeting, during which that developer will discuss key ideas and proposals. An additional 10 minutes may be allocated to post the result of this meeting. The morning meeting could also be posted. Development team is to listen, consider, and answer.


What would you do?
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[Mar 20, 2013 5:35:54 PM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
Pixulayted

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Re: So you just bought OOO... Reply to this Post
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I would shelve puzzle whatsits and roll around in my money while I listen to the SK soundtrack.

What would you do?

And on a side note, it would be nice if someone with any sort of say in things posted a response... but then again game design went to [barnacle] a while ago :(.

where are thou, community manager? Or even any other OM who will pretend that the devs are reading this forum.
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[Edit 1 times, last edit by Aphrodite at Mar 21, 2013 6:45:53 AM]
[Mar 20, 2013 6:32:59 PM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
PhantomNuke

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where are thou, community manager? Or even any other OM who will pretend that the devs are reading this forum.


I think we scared them off the last time they gave us the "ideas are being looked at by developers" line. Personally I was amusing myself with the idea that the developers have a sense of humour and would post what they would do if they suddenly found themselves in charge...


As for rolling around in your money... If that's a common response, it would explain a lot. =P
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[Mar 20, 2013 6:35:59 PM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
LJAmethyst

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You are only making their jobs harder by cluttering GD with parley-worthy topics.
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[Mar 20, 2013 7:52:29 PM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message    http://www.newadvent.org/bible/jon001.htm [Link]  Go to top 
Pixulayted

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You are only making their jobs harder by cluttering GD with parley-worthy topics.

Wait... they do jobs? Why don't we hear about this... :(

Also, I'll stop turning every thread into "parley-worthy topics" when a dev comes forward and responds to at least 10 GD threads with a helpful, thought out, response, that enlightens us on their actions with such idea in the OP of that thread.


So basically.... never.
[Mar 20, 2013 8:43:08 PM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
TheRack

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Rack strolled into the overflowing board room, and took a seat at the head of the table. He sat there silent as all looked on nervously, with the entire crew having been summoned on deck to hear him speak. A new captain was on board, and nobody knew what was in store.

The captain looked over to his newly appointed first mate. She was dressed as a swashbuckler, with an eye patch over her eye - markedly different from the land lubber first seen in the reception area last week, applying for the personal assistant's role. Rack gave her a nod and she scurried off, and quickly returned with enough fine rum for all in the room.

The room had a deafening silence about it, eyes darting from one to another. Each waited for somebody else to break the ice, with the situation becoming even more awkward the longer the silence continued. Several looked into the fresh brew that had been placed into their hand, wondering if they should drink, but none wanting to be the first to take a swig.

Eventually Cleaver leaned forward and cleared his throat.

"So Rack, you have summoned us all, from the freshest of fresh cabin crew, to the oldest hands. You have the undivided and unquestioned loyalty of this crew, and we are proud to sail under your flag. But pray tell us, now that you have your hand on the helm what is the first order of business?"

Rack stroked his chin thoughtfully, and the looked Cleaver in they eye.

"Well first, there is this thread in Game Design which would be best served being whisked to Shore Leave..."
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[Mar 21, 2013 3:52:20 AM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
Momma_Wolf



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At one time, there were "OM Office hours" when Hermes (I think it was, it's been a while) spent a half hour or so in a house to talk to - anyone - that wanted to come, with a whisk from the NB. I found many of the discussions to be entertaining, enlightening and informative. Perhaps something like this could be instituted again? Not everyone reads these forums, some don't even know (or care!) they exist, but an open discussion held on each ocean has the potential to reach everyone that plays.
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Anyone may demand answers of the gods.
Getting them is another matter.

[Mar 21, 2013 6:37:50 AM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
PhantomNuke

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Well, no, this isn't an entirely serious thread, but it wasn't intended to be parley-grade or even material for mariner's muse. Does appear to have been interpreted that way, with only two responses and both giving a good chuckle.

No, the original intent of this thread was for a show of hands to see who wants what. Perfectly happy for a copy to be posted in Parley or even in Muse, if people want to pursue their own amusement. This thread can be moved there if nobody wants to be serious (don't blame you).


Edit: Took so long writing this post that I got sniped by half an hour, by a very good post
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Game Design: A place to hide all your posts from OOO employees.
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[Edit 1 times, last edit by PhantomNuke at Mar 21, 2013 7:19:31 AM]
[Mar 21, 2013 7:18:13 AM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
TexasBeesh

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I do understand why OOO does not listen to everyone or even respond. At least I think I have an idea.

I worked on a courthouse project (renovation). I had to go in EVERY space of the courthouse and document existing conditions before any real work was started.

As soon as they found out what I was there for, the flood of ideas from the "clients" came in. Almost everyone working in the court house had something to say about how they wanted their space to function. >.< Holy cow...what a mess.

The project had limits and I was not going to sit down and explain this to hundreds of people.

I'm not a computer or programer type but I know that even if an idea is a good one, sometimes its not feasible for one reason or the other.

Adding things to a game or even a floor plan can have major chain reactions (even if the clients don't understand that). It's not as easy as it sounds to simply put something in game I am sure. Just like it's not easy to just add another room or floor to a building. I have to think mechanical, electrical, pluming...structural...

I read a lot on here whey people say, it should be "easy". Well let me tell you even moving all wall 6" has its complications...

So if game design is anything like building design in this aspect, I get it.
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[Mar 21, 2013 7:29:20 AM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
Notsizzly

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I think I'm just repeating what has been said so many times before but I'll say it anyway...

We don't really need Three Rings to respond to every single idea, post, thread or suggestion - actually, we don't really want that. That would just lead to a mess as Texasbeesh described. We would just like to get *some* more communication. We saw Cleaver responding to the adventure thread quite quickly but are still waiting something concerning the tablet discussion - it's been..three weeks since the last post by Three Rings?

And I agree, as always, about anyone saying it's easy to do this and that - we don't really know unless we work for Three Rings, no matter how much experience we've got under our belts.

Lot of the frustration comes from the lack of communication, which is not just 'plzzzzz respndzzzz 2 mai ides!!11!!1' - for example, I'm yet to see that Three Rings actually confirms whether or not what we players see as a bug with foraging, is actually a bug or an intended feature. (Well, at least I haven't seen that yet, so if this has been confirmed, excuse my lack of knowledge)
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[Mar 21, 2013 7:53:48 AM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
amartino

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I've seen this in other games too- an interesting dynamic where because of some players tenure in playing the game coupled with the extent to which they are immersed in all aspects of gameplay, they mentally take the next step in blurring the lines and morph this into an idea that they are somehow inextricably and directly tied to the development of said game.

This, IMO, is simply not the case and is also NOT a sign that, in this case OOO, has turned a blind eye to it's faithful player-base. While devs sometimes tap user focus groups (as a sounding board for upcoming functionality and then later as a player based beta testing resource) AND more passively glean overall sentiment of people already playing the game from places like these forums, truth is it is not the main driver of the priority nor content that they put in a given development sprint or yearly game expansion roadmap. They are acutely aware of existing bugs and address they incrementally from release to release based several factors including whether they're actual bugs vs intended aspects of gameplay that tend to 'bug players', a weighted take of each of our issues relative to how pervasive of an issue it is, how easy / labor intensive of a fix is involved and simply the trade-off in each issue's importance compared to new game functionality that some of the same dev resources would otherwise be doing. It's kind of a damned if you do, damned if you don't scenario as far as player based perceptions of the extent to which the devs 'care' and it honestly gets real old to the point where you just do what you know is needed based on all the considerations above and not get overly absorbed into the day to day compulsive need for communication some players have that will never really be satisfied, and to be blunt- is just a distraction (beyond the areas of communication already described)

So stop feeling like it's a personal affront when they aren't involved with your ideas, issues, questions at the level you perceive they should be. They decided to announce the tablet platform because they had already preannounced the Kraken add-on and felt it necessary to do so as it impacted it's go live date, noting there's an overlap of some of the same resources on both projects. Getting that level of communication to a player base is actually rare. Irony is when they do, the expectation then becomes that they should continue on a frequent basis- ya know the whole 'u just can't win effect'.

Bottom line is.. When things come together on either front to the extent that it justifies another communication, they'll do so. Period. In the meantime, I dunno, PLAY the game :)
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[Edit 1 times, last edit by amartino at Mar 21, 2013 11:21:44 AM]
[Mar 21, 2013 11:06:54 AM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
Notsizzly

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I've seen this in other games too- an interesting dynamic where because of some players tenure in playing the game coupled with the extent to which they are immersed in all aspects of gameplay, they mentally take the next step in blurring the lines and morph this into an idea that they are somehow inextricably and directly tied to the development of said game.

This, IMO, is simply not the case and is also NOT a sign that, in this case OOO, has turned a blind eye to it's faithful player-base. While devs sometimes tap user focus groups (as a sounding board for upcoming functionality and then later as a player based beta testing resource) AND more passively glean overall sentiment of people already playing the game from places like these forums, truth is it is not the main driver of the priority nor content that they put in a given development sprint or yearly game expansion roadmap. They are acutely aware of existing bugs and address they incrementally from release to release based several factors including whether they're actual bugs vs intended aspects of gameplay that tend to 'bug players', a weighted take of each of our issues relative to how pervasive of an issue it is, how easy / labor intensive of a fix is involved and simply the trade-off in each issue's importance compared to new game functionality that some of the same dev resources would otherwise be doing. It's kind of a damned if you do, damned if you don't scenario as far as player based perceptions of the extent to which the devs 'care' and it honestly gets real old to the point where you just do what you know is needed based on all the considerations above and not get overly absorbed into the day to day compulsive need for communication some players have that will never really be satisfied, and to be blunt- is just a distraction (beyond the areas of communication already described)

So stop feeling like it's a personal affront when they aren't involved with your ideas, issues, questions at the level you perceive they should be. They decided to announce the tablet platform because they had already preannounced the Kraken add-on and felt it necessary to do so as it impacted it's go live date, noting there's an overlap of some of the same resources on both projects. Getting that level of communication to a player base is actually rare. Irony is when they do, the expectation then becomes that they should continue on a frequent basis- ya know the whole 'u just can't win effect'.

Bottom line is.. When things come together on either front to the extent that it justifies another communication, they'll do so. Period. In the meantime, I dunno, PLAY the game :)


While you are right to a point, I don't fully agree, neither do I think everyone asking for some communication and feedback is at personal level as you suggest. Besides, afterall, the customers are what are important to any company wishing to make profit. If you want to simplify that thought, it means the players of this game - and if we want to make real life comparisons (which is kind of silly), customer service, quality of the services and products you sell and such are as much factors of PP as it is, oh idk, the restaurant you go out for a dinner.

Players are tied to a development to any game to some extent, not in a way that they'd be the only factors and just say 'do like this' and the company will. I don't know if anyone else can see the complex (or well, pretty simple) relationship between the players and game but as obviously as it is. And again, since we don't work for Three Rings, we can't say we know this or that or anything. We can only guess.
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[Mar 21, 2013 11:48:57 AM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
xelto

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I think I'm just repeating what has been said so many times before but I'll say it anyway...

We don't really need Three Rings to respond to every single idea, post, thread or suggestion - actually, we don't really want that. That would just lead to a mess as Texasbeesh described. We would just like to get *some* more communication.

Even something like a post saying We'll answer two questions posted in this thread at semi-random at the end of the month. That is, we'll look at two questions at random-- if there's a reason for us to not answer either of them, we'll pick a different question and not say anything about the one we skipped. You're limited to one question each. Questions don't have to be about YPP or OOO, though we recommend it if you don't want the rest of game design to make you walk the plank. Our answers will be accurate to the best of our knowledge, but may not be complete. That gives us some sort of focused communication, while allowing them lots of flexibility in what they respond to.

It doesn't have to be precisely that-- in fact, there may be some good reasons for it not to be that-- but some sort of communication is important, not just for the egos here, but for the game as a whole. There has been a growing amount of negativism on the oceans, and a surprising amount comes from people that I know don't hang out on the forums. Having semi-regular feedback from developers would go a long way towards convincing people that the game is not, in fact, actually being abandoned.
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[Mar 21, 2013 12:02:31 PM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
Pixulayted

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I think I'm just repeating what has been said so many times before but I'll say it anyway...

We don't really need Three Rings to respond to every single idea, post, thread or suggestion - actually, we don't really want that. That would just lead to a mess as Texasbeesh described. We would just like to get *some* more communication. We saw Cleaver responding to the adventure thread quite quickly but are still waiting something concerning the tablet discussion - it's been..three weeks since the last post by Three Rings?


We don't need a response to every post in every thread. I'd like to see one or two general posts about whether or not an idea is even worth thinking about, and if it is, do they plan to implement it someday.
If its not worth thinking about, update the list/anti-list... makes it helpful for those with new ideas.
[Mar 21, 2013 2:50:10 PM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
OtherJenny

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where are thou, community manager? Or even any other OM who will pretend that the devs are reading this forum.


Come on RL People we are paying your wages ...... How about Talking to us :)
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[Mar 21, 2013 5:16:06 PM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
Aeternis

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where are thou, community manager? Or even any other OM who will pretend that the devs are reading this forum.


Come on RL People we are paying your wages ...... How about Talking to us :)


You're not being serious, are you?
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[Mar 22, 2013 12:38:50 AM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
Tloser

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where are thou, community manager? Or even any other OM who will pretend that the devs are reading this forum.


Come on RL People we are paying your wages ...... How about Talking to us :)


You're not being serious, are you?


Don't see a problem with what she said, to be honest.
But can't expect much different from you, only ever out to put others down with your posts, its easier to just skim past them.
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[Mar 22, 2013 1:35:10 AM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
wrs1864b

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where are thou, community manager? Or even any other OM who will pretend that the devs are reading this forum.

Come on RL People we are paying your wages ...... How about Talking to us :)

If you want to pay someone to talk with you, see a therapist. The money you pay to OOO, if you actually pay at all, is for access to certain features of the game.

While I think it would be useful for them to talk a little more to their players, that is really up to them. There certainly are drawbacks to spending too much time talking, and no matter how much communication they do, some people won't be satisfied. I am confident that OOO will rightly ignore players who think the can demand attention.

If you want a particular feature, you need to think up novel ways of convincing OOO the feature is worth their time to implement, without being given any feed back. That means the feature must be easy to program (without seeing the actual code to know if it is), and actually help players (without seeing the data that OOO has collected on players).

Consider it a puzzle to solve.
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[Mar 22, 2013 2:45:47 AM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
PhantomNuke

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In the meantime, I dunno, PLAY the game :)


No. This game is now so fraught with problems that I no longer find it pleasant to play. I want to, but it's just a waste of my time. It's far more fun to go on the forums and actually do something, even if it's just writing up ideas that'll never see the light of day, than it is to sit in port and glare at the lack of jobbers.
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[Mar 22, 2013 2:47:58 AM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
Aeternis

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Actually I try to be helpful most of the times, but some opinions are just so, em stupid, that you just have to ask if they are serious.
The "we pay your wages" line is just not true. Not in this case and not in 99% of the cases it is used.
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[Mar 22, 2013 2:55:27 AM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
Notsizzly

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I want to bring sunshine to your day, hence why I'm posting again! That's because I'm so all around awesome person and magnificently wonderful.

Saying that 'players pay the wages' is as true as saying 'players don't pay the wages' - I thought it's obvious why. There indeed, are drawbacks on spending too much time listening to the players and responding them, but then again, there are drawbacks in not doing so, too. Most of the time, the magic 99%, everything and anything has always the pros and cons, two sides of the story, advantages and disadvantages - I don't see a point in arguing over that kind of a simple, basic nature of anything that exists in this world (unless of course, in this context, it's an idea discussed in Game Design).

Anyone can demand anything s/he wants. It's up to, in this case, Three Rings to decide what they'll do if anything. That shouldn't be seen as a reason to stop asking for more or better - if nobody ever wants any changes, then there's no point in developers and development at all, is there?

I'm bringing up the foraging bug again, as an example of why it would be beneficial for Three Rings to confirm (actually, I guess, commenting at all about it) what's up with that. The thread was created, the bug has been reported probably several times by now. The bug has been discussed over and over again. It keeps popping up in in-game discussions ever so randomly, when players don't understand why the duty reports change from poor to incredible, while they're puzzling method doesn't change and they're doing as the tutorial tells them to do. This will probably go on for forever, we keep talking about it, we keep demanding to fix it, we bring it up unnecessarily when it could be avoided by having Three Rings giving an official confirmation if it is a feature or a bug - and yes, I'm aware that by doing so, they'd be setting themselves in a situation where they should be doing the same thing for all the possible bugs, demands, questions and whatnots that we players bring up. The question is, is it more beneficial for Three Rings to not to confirm what we think is a bug (and deal with the never stopping complaining about it) or to confirm either way (and ...well, deal with whatever that brings)?

Uhh..peace out. I need to spend some more time in the inn than on the forums. I need my eggs. I NEED.
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[Mar 22, 2013 3:37:27 AM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
Akbarx

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Well ill use ig players as moderators on forums (highly trusted ones). They will be given power to lock unwanted threads and ban people from the forum and manage the ban appeal section (will be created). I will develop a more intresting start to the game.. Like Jolly roger(or a bk) vs us and we are on the vessel with bot who is bnaving. The score is max-0 and we will be given details of teaming and so on. I would fix poker and then promote alot of ads. I will create secret missions for dub buyers and will consider f2p players as a gem than cow dung. I will create a new security system with security questions. Then i will allow blockading of most islands. Also i will kill all the oms.
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<3 Akbarx...

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[Jun 11, 2013 4:28:45 AM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
Jezzebel

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Well ill use ig players as moderators on forums (highly trusted ones). <snip> Also i will kill all the oms.


Faulkston is a player forum moderator.

And I don't know where you're from, but in the US you don't get to murder employees.
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Redjenny, Now merged with Health Nutz
Thebloggess wrote: 
A hug is like a strangle you haven't finished yet!

[Jun 11, 2013 8:38:09 AM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
Godoftheloch

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Re: So you just bought OOO... Reply to this Post
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Well ill use ig players as moderators on forums (highly trusted ones). They will be given power to lock unwanted threads and ban people from the forum and manage the ban appeal section (will be created). I will develop a more intresting start to the game.. Like Jolly roger(or a bk) vs us and we are on the vessel with bot who is bnaving. The score is max-0 and we will be given details of teaming and so on. I would fix poker and then promote alot of ads. I will create secret missions for dub buyers and will consider f2p players as a gem than cow dung. I will create a new security system with security questions. Then i will allow blockading of most islands. Also i will kill all the oms.

This post isn't very constructive. Try Shore Leave instead.
[Jun 11, 2013 11:48:33 AM] Show Printable Version of Post        Send Private Message [Link]  Go to top 
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