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Posted by muffy at Jul 27, 2003 10:40:46 AM
Tournaments
So, there are a few things that would have helped tremendously with the tournament. I don't know if tournament support is on the infamous list, but here are some requests from me experiences with running one tournament.

Ability to announce tournaments. For now, perhaps we could have a tournament forum, and a suggestion to people when they join that they check it out if they're interested in participating. Longer term, it would be nice to be able to post tournament info somewhere, perhaps the notice board? If the notice board, it would be nice to be able to post it to ALL of the notice boards - perhaps by applying to the governors of the various islands, in advance?

Transport. Now that more than one archipelago is settled, people can't always get to the tournaments. If we use the notice board, as above, perhaps people could be automatically ferried to the island in question by a button on the notice board? Even better, drop 'em right into the palace on that island.

Scores It would be nice to be able to see who won and lost. A suggestion for making this simple - within rooms in the palace, "broadcast" results of any contest. So, if ye're in the room, ye'll get a notification that says "Bluebeard beat Redbeard at swordfighting" or "Drinking game: Redbeard 500, Bluebeard 390, Greenbeard 340".

More complex support:

Sign-up interface. People can click on buttons for the events they want to sign up for, and junior (plain experience) and senior (bold experience) divisions. At the time of the tourney, their presence is "registered" when they show up, and they are then grouped for the various rounds of the contest, possibly with the manual intervention of the organizer.

I'm sure there's more, but I can't think of other things at the moment.
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Avatar by Rubby

Posted by Xel at Jul 27, 2003 11:34:33 AM
Re: Tournaments
It'd certainly be nice to have all those features, but we managed to have a tournament with about 53 people today. Of course, it was in-crew only, which made it easier because everyone could just hop on a ship in port at our island. I definately hope something like this is added sometime, but right now I'd think there are probably more important things.

Posted by muffy at Jul 27, 2003 11:49:30 AM
how about something constructive?
Aye, and there are more important things in the world. Rather than being dismissive of the topic, how about posting what worked or didn't work for yer tournament?
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Avatar by Rubby

Posted by homullus at Jul 27, 2003 11:50:31 AM
Re: Tournaments
Well, tournaments could become more commonplace (and less Ringer-centric) with sufficient tools. Aside from squashing game bugs, this is one work project that would mean less work for them long-term.

I worry about insta-ferry being abused. We could have a tournament every day to ferry people trans-archipelago.

Even just a bracket thingy with blanks, that gets filled in with /register (name) or something would be nice. It would be nice if such a thing could be set up by anyone like drinking games are, with an ante and rules (best of 3 etc). Then people click on the person setting up the game and join. If the setter-upper wanted to set the prize money they could enter it when they started, otherwise the prize is made up from the entry fees.

Swordfighting was by far the hardest contest to run, it seemed.

Posted by shockedfrog at Jul 27, 2003 9:04:24 PM
Re: Tournaments
for the sake of people who want to see who wins, being able to spectate games would be handy, but im sure thats been discussed many times, and would probably add lag to the actual fighters. Booched, I know.

For the duty contests, and just for people who like to keep track of how well their crew are doing, an option to see the last duty report - a 'Last Report' button - or even the last 3/5 reports, would be handy.

Anyway, insta ferry seems fine to me, people can already instatravel via crew ships with a helper, and fast travel via navy ships, and entry money would be paid before the tournament anyway, so you wouldnt need to bring money there (and wouldnt be allowed to :)
If you're really worried about it being abusable, give the player some sort of 'Guest' status that doesn't allow them to leave the building/island/boat where the tournament is, doesn't allow them to dig up money there or use their bank or take trades from anyone (the event prize money/items could always be paid later, on an island they have properly travelled to)

Sign up interface would be good, but it would need to be customisable unless the organizer planned to organise everything themselves - allow people to set the cut off point (if there's two tournaments) or a requirements if it's just one elite/newbie tournament, allow people to use experience or standings as requirements, perhaps for swordfights, rules like '*certain sword* only and it gives the player a temporary sword (ooh, how evil it would be to hold a Temporary Tournament Cleaver and then when you're just beginning to like it, GONE! :)

Scores for drinking broadcast around the place would be nice, but I think that people who really want to know will watch the game themselves, or if its swordfighting, just ask the other people who were there.

And anything that expands the usefulness of the noticeboard is a good idea :) Announcing tournaments would be essential since you can't rely on word of mouth all the time - i figured being on the forum, yesterdays tournament would be known by everyone, but half of the crew i talked to never even knew there was a tourney and only turned up after I told them.

Posted by Stoneman at Jul 27, 2003 9:57:51 PM
Re: Tournaments
Hmmm.. Some good ideas here...
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-=Stoneman, Officer of Black Death=-
-=Feared now and then=-

Posted by garf at Jul 27, 2003 10:32:01 PM
Re: Tournaments
shockedfrog wrote: 
For the duty contests, and just for people who like to keep track of how well their crew are doing, an option to see the last duty report - a 'Last Report' button - or even the last 3/5 reports, would be handy.


a lot of very good suggestions there, but this is me personal favorite because its not exclusively usefull for tournaments.


when taking out a relatively fresh small crew on a little pillage, and the seas are empty once again, i often like to hang out on the crows nest instead of navigating as me multitasking seems to be too bad to catch every target while puzzling meself.

but right now that means i cannot see the duty ratings, and with new players that would be very helpfull to get that boocher off the sails to somewhere he cant hurt or to see that the carpers do their work.
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- Randal

[size=9]also Garf, Silvain and a few others

Posted by muffy at Jul 28, 2003 1:07:10 AM
think tournament
shockedfrog wrote: 
For the duty contests, and just for people who like to keep track of how well their crew are doing, an option to see the last duty report - a 'Last Report' button - or even the last 3/5 reports, would be handy.


Fabulous idea, particularly as ye don't always get the duty reports if ye're movin' around the ship or usin' the crow's nest.

shockedfrog wrote: 
Anyway, insta ferry seems fine to me, people can already instatravel via crew ships with a helper, and fast travel via navy ships, and entry money would be paid before the tournament anyway, so you wouldnt need to bring money there (and wouldnt be allowed to :)


I agree; we already have "instaferry" for our crew by havin' crewmembers (or alts) with different homes and a ship in every port. Or a friendly crew to perform the same service. I personally provide a dozen or so 'ports a day.

Another thing in this post reminds me - "entry fees". ARR (really me) "sponsored" this last tournament, meaning that it was completely free to entrants. Most people didn't seem to understand this. But aye, if there IS is a tournament-whisking ability, it should also collect the entry fee, if any, and the posting should include a cost (including "free").

shockedfrog wrote: 
Scores for drinking broadcast around the place would be nice, but I think that people who really want to know will watch the game themselves, or if its swordfighting, just ask the other people who were there.


Think tournament here. First, suppose there are even just two tables of drinking, or four pairs of swordfighters - with drinking, ye simply can't watch both at once, with swordfighting, staring at the screen to see whose head drops, switching back and forth between people, it is really quite difficult. Plus, watching the drinking game does not allow ye to see anything but the winner, while in fact ye'd want to see all the scores, and the order of winners, since typically more than one person moves on to the next round. I'd like the in-room announcement (and note that I only asked for this at the palace, not everywhere), because scrolling back through the chat is easy enough, and lets ye look away from the screen at least briefly while the people are competing, which ye surely couldn't if ye were tryin' to watch all 10 pairs (or more!) of swordfighters to see who won.
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Avatar by Rubby

Posted by homullus at Jul 28, 2003 2:05:42 AM
Re: Tournaments
Heck, maybe just add some object (a leader board, or a trophy, or something) in the game that allows a setup box for tournaments akin to the drinking dialogue . . . then it could be put in palaces and big ships, and big open areas outside, and not take up much room. Then people can walk up, inspect the tournament, and hopefully accept the tournament and give their entry fee. When a tournament is set up, the player can pick which notice board(s) show it. The notice board could also include inspecting the tournament, since people can't whisk their money away.

If we allow freedom to set up tournaments and free whisking, there would be no point in not having inter-archipelago ferries. I realize there is free whisking, but it is entirely at the option of the person on the target island. They don't HAVE to do it, and they don't HAVE to do it for free. If we set up free tournaments, anyone will be able to join one and whisk to that island. Crews could set up "tournaments" 24/7 for free easy transport, and it would take away much of the thrill of seeing a tournament posted, since they'd ALWAYS be there. In fact, there would be the risk of people picking (and paying for) the WRONG tournament, paying of a whisking instead of the grand contest.

I don't necessarily have a problem with this (free travel everywhere), but it is at odds with Cleaver's expressed wish to have the game not be one big archipelago. If we want to do that, then just have free ferries going inter-archipelago, and not have whisking with tournaments at all.

Posted by akebia at Aug 1, 2003 4:23:12 AM
Re: Tournaments
I fondly remember the Tournament Green on pre-scroll-y Alpha Island. Perhaps realty offices would let pirates build a new tournament green (or an arena, or a clubhouse, or a tent, or something) with some nifty features for running a tournament.

One of the great thing about the tournaments is that they aren't all about swordfighting. (Why, I won my monkey in a contest that didn't actually take place using the Java client!) I feel sort of lame suggesting all these features that are so heavily biased towards swordfighting, but here goes:

First pass: (Inn : Drinking :: Arena : Swordfighting)

Victories and losses are announced throughout the building.

So that duellers can have fair fights, the manager will provide a bucket of loaner swords. The swords would be restricted to the arena, just as in the clothing shoppe.

The arena will have stations for setting up three-on-three team fights, like the favorites of skelly hunting and sea battling.

Second pass: (automatic tournaments)

Add a ladder or leaderboard, ranking every fighter who fights in the building. It would be based fights in this building only, not the standard ocean-wide rating scheme. There might even be different rules for moving up and down on this list. The manager can reset this board at will to prepare for new tournaments.

Add a tournament tree. Managers can set options like "double-elimination" or "best-of-n fights per match". The tree is seeded... somehow. Pirates can challenge each other to fight, as usual, but their fights can be counted towards an open match on the tree. Brackets and advancements would be handled automatically. Managers could declare forfeits.

Why would it be built? (Hey, what's an Innkeeper do now, anyway?)

Managers should have some recurring costs or obligations for owning this building. So: Tournament prizes should be funded by the manager. The manager should keep the sword bucket fresh. Perhaps everyone in the building will slowly consume rum, or perhaps the NPP referees will draw a salary.

Managers should be able to collect money for owning this building. They could have standard membership fees, applied to folks who want to try out a new sword or set up a three-on-three battle. They could charge tournament entry fees.

Posted by homullus at Aug 1, 2003 4:28:15 AM
Re: Tournaments
Aye, every inn could have its own Fight Club. It would make them rowdy places, instead of the silent bastions of binge drinking they are now.

Posted by Gotagota at Aug 1, 2003 6:25:44 AM
Re: Tournaments
I like this.
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Fronsac, human.
Perfection is achieved, not when there is nothing more to
add, but when there is nothing left to take away.
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-Antoine de Saint-Exupéry


Posted by Anonymous at Aug 3, 2003 2:59:36 PM
Re: Tournaments
I really, really like the Inn-as-a-Fight-Club idea. I'd like to see both the automated tournaments, and random team brawls. It sets the Inn up as an actually useful building, which would be nice.


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